[Gasification] Continuing

[Thomas Reed]

Dear Anand

My impression is that bacteria adjust to conditions:  If you build it, they will come.

Yes or no?

Tom Reed



Dr Thomas B Reed
President, The Biomass Energy Foundation
www.Woodgas.com

On Jul 20, 2011, at 3:06 PM, phillip manske <pdmanske at gmail.com> wrote:

> This is my bacteria. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
> My bacteria is my best friend. It is my life. I must master it as I
> must master my life.
> My bacteria, without me, is useless. Without my bacteria, I am
> useless. I must fire my bacteria true. I must shoot straighter than my
> enemy who is trying to kill me. I must shoot him before he shoots me.
> I will...
> My bacteria and myself know that what counts in this war is not the
> rounds we fire, the noise of our burst, nor the smoke we make. We know
> that it is the hits that count. We will hit...
> My bacteria is human, even as I, because it is my life. Thus, I will
> learn it as a brother. I will learn its weaknesses, its strength, its
> parts, its accessories, its sights and its barrel. I will ever guard
> it against the ravages of weather and damage as I will ever guard my
> legs, my arms, my eyes and my heart against damage. I will keep my
> bacteria clean and ready. We will become part of each other. We
> will...
> Before God, I swear this creed. My bacteria and myself are the
> defenders of my country. We are the masters of our enemy. We are the
> saviors of my life.
> So be it, until victory is America's and there is no enemy, but peace!
> 
> <pdmanske at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> This pathway should be the most simple so its likely a good place to
>> start.  I'm not certain what to do first.  I liked shopping for
>> reactors and why not?  Shopping is fun.  I was unaware there are large
>> (1000 gal) glass lined reactors.
>> 
>> Where to start?  In my clumsy manner I say get a microscope and then
>> the strain ($250 from ATC)
>> 
>> Look at the freeze dried 'crobes under the scope.  Should see shoe
>> leather plus the "meat" packing that comes with the strain.
>> Re animate using only distilled water and examine under scope
>> Re animate and add nutrients and look under scope
>>    See how long  that batch lasts
>> 
>> Re animate using nutrients plus extra feed like fructose or yeast extract
>>  This should be enough to keep the culture alive for a regular
>> lifetime of the 'crobes.
>> 
>> PV, is this close?  Are my techniques sound?
>> 
>> My technique is a combination practical effort plus me releaning lab techniques.
>> 
>> I'm not clear on how to do census.  You are supposed to sample from
>> the quadrants and the center.  Anaerobes are supposed to collect away
>> from O2  and that means the bottom of the vessel.
>> 
>> I don't know how long that nutrient will last.  The CO and CO2 feed is
>> like making the 'crobes live on bananas.  Bananas are healthy but its
>> not nutritious enough for life, hence the vitamin pill like nutrients
>> that are necessary.  The calories come from the gases, the vitamins
>> come from the nutrients.
>> 
>> 
>> I wanted to hire someone to do this because I'm just gonna bash around
>> int he early stages and then likely later on too.  Maybe i can get by
>> with a consult.
>> 
>> I can't do mcuh until I get my libary card, there is mcuh more
>> material to read than what I have collected so far.
>> 
>> Phillip
>> 
>> 
>> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 11:53 AM, Pannirselvam  P.V <pannirbr at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>  Dea Dr T.Reed and Philip
>>>      The  CO2  and  CO from   producer gas    can provide acetate, thus ,
>>> there is  no  need for carbohyrates , this  low quality producer  gas can be
>>>  upgraded. The system  is more solid gas tricking filter bio reactor .
>>>   Dr Thomas  is correct   that  the mixed bacteria systems can   , at room
>>> temperature   solid liquid slurry in    know biodigster system  the reaction
>>> he wrote , but  let input of CH2O , more CO and CO2  , via adoptation  need
>>> to be done for  gas solid biodigestors
>>> 
>>>   Unlike conventional bio digestor, there is a need  to make
>>> the correct mixed bacteria  that can make  acetate (acids) from gas  , then
>>>  methane  is synthesised  by hydrogen bacteria via CO water shift  to
>>> hydrogen, which readily combine with  CO  to make  methane , as well as
>>> CO2.( At  atm pressure , low temperature ), wher as very high temp used to
>>> make co  shift via thermoconversion system
>>>  The problems with this new system , unlike conventional biodidestor, is
>>>  the bacter cell  growth  and viability   without carbohydrate (CH20) ,
>>> unlike the system  which Dr.Reed has correctly wrotefor  the  biogas
>>> production where  ther is also parelel  auto catalytics bacteria
>>> reproducation .Philip Manske  here in his recent post has reported thatv the
>>> CO make bacterial cell gorwth and viabilit  possible .This  is very
>>>  positive  good results  .Biodigestor  bacterial  catatyst has the  problem
>>> of  useful active life time ,The  biocatalysts , microbes ,do not have
>>> unlimited  life time of activity .Need to be replaced .This is considered to
>>> be  negative point , but can be managed, with economic loss too
>>>    Instead of  separating  and upgrading  SNG  obtained   from low quality
>>> producer gas  via  bioprocessos , the direct use  of this for charcoal
>>> gasification can  give biochar and  high quality   syngas  for metanol or
>>> ethanol  via bio or thermoconversion .
>>>   Thus small biorefineray of coupled biotherm process , origionally
>>>  patended  by IGT, USA can  be adopted  and make posible for CHP  energy
>>> production  and methanol Co production  as small grid based biorefinery.
>>> 
>>> Dr Reed  , can be consider as  origional thinker  and father who had  long
>>> time vision of sustainable  syngas, methanol frrom  biomass and bioenergy
>>> power .His long time dream  can be reality as compared  to biomass ethanol
>>> projects sustainabilty of  several waste biomass  residues upgrading into
>>> biopower .As   the gasoline , ethanol ,methanol can be well mixed , can go
>>> well  more sustainable transportation fuel ate present and future
>>> For the same yet proven technology are needed , Integrated However
>>>  the Biotherm process  ,CHP and methanol  are  complex system ,need good
>>> system design  and engineering work  from diversified experts, but not  as
>>>  such as big petro refinery  projects
>>> Our lists do have  this diversity , dynamic members , thus make possible  to
>>> compare known technology , innovate new one do , get help from experts from
>>> this list made posible by TOM
>>>    Some off topics are  good , but need not exceed  the main topics too
>>> Your sincerely
>>> Panirselvam P.V
>>> Brazil
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Tue, Jul 19, 2011 at 5:51 PM, Thomas Reed <tombreed2010 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Dear Phillip
>>>> 
>>>> The power generation sounds interesting.
>>>> 
>>>> What is the feed sock for the digester?  Carbohydrates?
>>>> 
>>>> 2 CH2O ===> CH4 + H2O.
>>>> 
>>>> A dr, carve in India has built a small  digestor that produces all the
>>>> methane needed to cook the meals.
>>>> 
>>>> I suppose a larger digester could supply the electric power too.
>>>> 
>>>> Keep talking...
>>>> 
>>>> Tom Reed
>>>> 
>>>> Dr Thomas B Reed
>>>> President, The Biomass Energy Foundation
>>>> www.Woodgas.com
>>>> 
>>>> On Jul 19, 2011, at 12:03 PM, phillip manske <pdmanske at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Hi Tom,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Its good to hear from you.  I taught ESL in Korea for six years and
>>>>> instead of coming back to the US directly, I went to Kiev and stayed
>>>>> in East Europe for year.  I went to Moldova, Poland and Romania too.
>>>>> I lived on the money I saved while in Korea and my Fed government
>>>>> pension.  I was poor there and I didn't do much but work on a website
>>>>> that was inspired by my Fed time.  I made a large Freedom of
>>>>> Information Act program and I did most of the work in cafe's with free
>>>>> WiFi.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Melitopol is in the Russian half of Ukraine, I generally like the
>>>>> Ukies better than the Russians but I think the women are more
>>>>> attractive.   I've been to Melitopol twice already.  No one visits
>>>>> Melitopol, its kind of a hole.  Anna is an ethnic Russian living in
>>>>> Ukraine.
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://khersongirls.com - that is the agency I recommend.  Consider
>>>>> all of the others as scams.  I've met the owner and I've been to the
>>>>> office many times.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> If you want to get involved with my "Gold" project you are welcome.
>>>>> Its gonna take some money but not much.  My investor advisor says to
>>>>> make the lab reactor and then the GEK scale reactor.  I think the lab
>>>>> reactor will look like this...
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://www.chemglass.com/product_view.asp?pnr=CLS-1404
>>>>> 
>>>>> I don't want to appear as a Johnny come lately into biofuels but it
>>>>> kind of looks that way.  I was an electrican in the navy a long time
>>>>> ago and I said I'd return to power generation if the things were
>>>>> right.  The concept is complicated, the practice is easy.  Once the
>>>>> gens run, there is no work to do.  You just need to check the engines
>>>>> twice a day and that takes 20 minutes max each time.  You really have
>>>>> the whole day off for the next fifteen years if you get a contract.
>>>>> 
>>>>> That's whats up.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Phillip
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Tue, Jul 19, 2011 at 7:31 AM, Thomas Reed <tombreed2010 at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> So, do you have an office in Melitopol?  Looks like it's close to the
>>>>>> black sea.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Tom
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Dr Thomas B Reed
>>>>>> President, The Biomass Energy Foundation
>>>>>> www.Woodgas.com
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Jul 18, 2011, at 10:25 PM, phillip manske <pdmanske at gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Hi Dr. Reed,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Thanks for the concern.  I had to pay bills for two months and then I
>>>>>>> needed some cash so I can go marriage agency dates in Ukraine.  I
>>>>>>> lived in Ukraine for a year so I kinda know whats up.  I found a woman
>>>>>>> there that likes me.  She looks like Meagan Fox but she has larger
>>>>>>> breasts.  She sells cosmetics and lives in Melitopol.  I work next to
>>>>>>> a corporate lake and the lake is feed by storm run off.  The lake has
>>>>>>> some good wildlife and I have taken to  turtle rescue when the chelons
>>>>>>> get stuck in the drainage pipes.  I got ten already.  I have a snapper
>>>>>>> hatchling and hand sized softshell on a shelf by my desk.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> That's pretty cool Phil but it has nothing to with biomass.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I don't talk about gasifiers here because I don't know Jack.
>>>>>>> Sometimes you just need to shut up and listen.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Yea so I decided I should read about the matter.
>>>>>>> This book is great.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/Transportation-Biofuels-Production-Biodiesel-Chemistry/dp/1849730431
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I got an eCopy if you want to see the relevant material.  The methane
>>>>>>> part looks way doable and in fact I'm slowly working on that.  I found
>>>>>>> sciencedirect.com which has a great index and all of the papers on the
>>>>>>> matter are availalbe for free at the uni library but I don't have my
>>>>>>> Indiana drives lic/ID yet so its another two weeks.  The papers come
>>>>>>> to $4500 if I have to pay.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I wrote an executive summary for someone at GoBig and I after I sent
>>>>>>> that off they asked for an executive summary and asked a few other
>>>>>>> questions.  I made a good post at GEK and I got ass kissy with Mr.
>>>>>>> Mason trying to amend my earlier offences.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Whats up with you Tom?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Warmest Regards
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Phillip
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Phillip Manske
>>>>>>> 195 w Puetz Rd h-114
>>>>>>> Oak Creek WI, 53154
>>>>>>> pmanske at afuels.net
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Alchemy Fuels Executive Summary
>>>>>>> Saturday, July 16, 2011
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The Energy Policy Act of 2005 has mandated that investor owned
>>>>>>> utilities must provide a certain amount of the energy they provide
>>>>>>> must be sourced from renewable sources.  This amount has been
>>>>>>> regulated to grow both now and in the future.  To date, wind and solar
>>>>>>> sources have been providing most of this energy while biomass sourced
>>>>>>> energy has lagged.  Utilities have been rejecting new applications for
>>>>>>> wind and solar energies while courting biomass providers as many slots
>>>>>>> are still open.  Alchemy has determined a course to make low cost
>>>>>>> biofuel to fulfill these requirements is a realistic and profitable
>>>>>>> goal.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> After reviewing scientific literature on the matter I, (working as
>>>>>>> Alchemy Fuels) have decided that a two stage reactor designed to make
>>>>>>> methane is the most efficient route to a biofuel called “biogas”.
>>>>>>> This method was developed early in the biofuels research efforts and
>>>>>>> then abandoned in favor of ethanol and other more lucrative
>>>>>>> transportation fuels.  Methane is a well founded and well functioning
>>>>>>> fuel for generators designed to work with natural gas.   This process
>>>>>>> is well reviewed and appreciated by the scientific community for its
>>>>>>> ease use and lack of exotic requirements.   It can be described as a
>>>>>>> methane digester without the required tons of manure feedstock.  The
>>>>>>> research was pioneered by a scientist named Gaddy who founded a
>>>>>>> company called BRI.  The process is referred as the microbial catalyst
>>>>>>> cellulosic fuel pathway.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The process uses the output from gasifiers that use wood mass as a
>>>>>>> feedstock.  A handful of gases are provided by the gasifier with the
>>>>>>> most important being carbon monoxide and the lesser gases being
>>>>>>> hydrogen, carbon dioxide and methane.  All of the gasses are used in
>>>>>>> the process.  The first stage of the process uses a bacteria called p.
>>>>>>> productus that uses the CO for growth and CO2 for the production of
>>>>>>> acetate which is the feedstock for the second and final stage where a
>>>>>>> bacteria called m. barkeri uses the acetate and hydrogen to make
>>>>>>> methane.  Methane, unlike ethanol , does not need distilling which
>>>>>>> saves considerable effort, energy and money.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The market for the gas or gas use comes from the aforementioned lack
>>>>>>> of biomass energy providers.  Contract length is from 10 – 20 years,
>>>>>>> amount of sale is typically 800 kilo watts per hour and the
>>>>>>> compensation is from $.10 - $.15  per Kw hour.    Providers are
>>>>>>> typically allowed to provide 24 hours a day.  Demand may vary but
>>>>>>> demand is typically strong.  Biogas contracts are generally designed
>>>>>>> for methane digesters but this type of process meets the legal
>>>>>>> definition of biogas even without the $1 million digester.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> This is a niche market but it can provide excellent returns and a
>>>>>>> number of contracts can be signed simultaneously.   Sales are assured,
>>>>>>> no distribution network is required.  Plants like this operate at a
>>>>>>> technician level and not an engineer or scientist level.  There are
>>>>>>> few critical points that may induce failure.  The required insurance
>>>>>>> is difficult to get but I have found a provider and at least one work
>>>>>>> around method.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Plants should be located near the biomass source to save money on
>>>>>>> transportation and when the gas is made, it can be shipped at much
>>>>>>> less expense to the generating facilities .   The plants will be
>>>>>>> filled with wood biomass, gasifiers and vats that look like
>>>>>>> microbrewery vats.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Being averse to large expenditures, I recommend a modest approach to
>>>>>>> first make a five gallon reactor using bottled gas, then a system
>>>>>>> using a small gasifier and then finally a system scaled to produce
>>>>>>> fuel at the rate to meet the 800 kwh limit.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The described  process above is worth study and investment.  The
>>>>>>> science is sound, the investment and risk is small, operating overhead
>>>>>>> is very low and sales are guaranteed.  It appears margins should be
>>>>>>> very wide unlike typical margins that are available to investors.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Questions may be directed to me at the email address above.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Regards
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Phillip Manske
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 9:46 PM, Thomas Reed <tombreed2010 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Phil
>>>>>>>> I haven't heard your name for.a decade or so.  What cooks in biomass?
>>>>>>>> Tom Reed
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Dr Thomas B Reed
>>>>>>>> President, The Biomass Energy Foundation
>>>>>>>> www.Woodgas.com
>>>>>>>> On Jul 18, 2011, at 7:04 PM,
>>>>>>>> "pbadger at bioenergyupdate.com"<pbadger at bioenergyupdate.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless
>>>>>>>> 
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> ************************************************
>>> P.V.PANNIRSELVAM
>>> ASSOCIATE . PROF.
>>> Research Group ,GPEC, Coordinator
>>> Computer aided  Cost engineering
>>> 
>>> DEQ – Departamento de Engenharia Química
>>> CT – Centro de Tecnologia / UFRN, Lagoa Nova – Natal/RN
>>> Campus Universitário. CEP: 59.072-970
>>> North East,Brazil
>>> *******************************************
>>> https://sites.google.com/a/biomassa.eq.ufrn.br/sites/
>>>  and
>>> http://ecosyseng.wetpaint.com/
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Fone ;Office
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