[Gasification] Clostridium Ljungdahlii

[jim mason]

phillip, the killer on these processes is the dewatering.  a 2% yield
of ethanol with 98% water to remove is not a small thermal problem.

what the specific yield numbers are, and how the energy balance works
out seems to vary around a bit.  but i've yet to see one that is
clearly in the tolerable range.  hopefully we'll see some in the
future, but currently the most successful yield via this route is
money from gullible vcs and govt.

the direct biomass to electricity to electrical storage for transport
seems a more accessible route than making ethanol.  of course this
requires evs to be available.  if we must have liquids from it,
methanol via catalyst continues to be the best bet mostly likely, with
potential upmigration to DME.  the FT diesel routes seem too messy for
the small scale given the cocktail outputs that need separation and
subsequent handling.

in the long interim, we should likely do with biomass what it most
easily used for- heat and electricity.  that is more than hard enough
to keep us all entertained at least until the rapture tomorrow!


j





On Fri, May 20, 2011 at 7:08 AM, phillip manske <pdmanske at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi - This is the bacteria that is used for making ethanol from syn
> gas.  This interested me so I did some research.  The reseacher that
> isolated the bacteria is named Ljundahl but the guy that did most of
> work is named Gaddy.  He has a company called BRI.  The early papers
> came out in the 90's.
>
> This process doesn't have the decades of wisdom that accompanies
> alchohol production, gasification and biodiesel.  The process is
> fairly straight forward and does not seem to require giant
> engineering.  I think a plant like this will have large tanks but to a
> sum of 4000 gallons of mash for 100 gallons of fuel.  The process is
> supposed to go fast.
> The useful strain is available for sale at $200.  They plants need
> 100F incubation and they produce ethanol  when not in growing phase
> which means the metabolism is slow.  The other substance is acetate
> (vinegar) which the plants make much more of. BRI collects the
> bacteria when the process is done so I think these plants don't breed
> much.  There is a 2% return in the volume and the 98% of water needs
> to be reviewed.    There seems to be a pressure requirement over the
> top of the culture at 1.5 ATM with 80% N and 20% CO2.
>
> I'm fairly certain a GEK would work although the papers say a
> fluidized bed gasifier is better.  I do not know where to get a
> fluidized bed gasifer and they always look like giant engineering to
> me.  Tire pyrolysis oils works better.  The papers always discuss
> sending syn gas bubbles through the solution.  Bacteria can't use
> atospheric gas so it looks like they rely on partial pressure to
> dissolve the gas into the solution.  If that is the case, it looks
> like you should start with a liquid with the same chemical contents as
> it looks like there is less fuss in transfering.
>
> Did we find out if reverse osmosis works for distillation yet?
>
> There aren't any tutorials, all of the reading is patents and
> scientific papers.  I have about 125 pages to read this weekend with
> three papers from Gaddy.
>
> I'm a low rent expert - I regisitered the domain
> http://clostridiumljungdahlii.com.
>
> I'll know it all by  Monday or Tuesday.
>
> Phillip
>
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