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<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Dear Mark</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"
dir=ltr>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=mark@ludlow.com href="mailto:mark@ludlow.com">Mark Ludlow</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org">'Discussion of biomass
pyrolysis and gasification'</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, October 18, 2010 4:48
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Gasification] the most
important thing (quitepossibly) i'velearned to date</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=WordSection1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Hi
Kevin!<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Second Law! Energy
is not “created” by the reaction. It already exists in the individual
components of the reaction.</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"># Very interesting
comment! However, I think you are inferring that my questions are an attempt
to violate the First Law, and not the Second. The First Law relates to the
balance between mass and energy in a reaction. It can be simply stated
as:</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">"First Law: You
can't get something for nothing."</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">The Second Law
deals with randomness and disorder, and the impossibility of getting a perfect
reaction. It can be stated equally simply as:</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">"Second Law: As a
matter of fact, you can't break even."</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"># My question
deals with how to set up the reaction so that with a given amount of chemical
energy in the feed input, the use of energy content of the output gas is
maximized. </SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Kevin, you can
answer your own question. </SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"># I think you
might have missed the significance of my question. What do you think my
question was?</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">The only excess
“free” energy is that which is expressed as sensible and latent thermal energy
of the gaseous output (however: we cool gases for greater volumetric
efficiency in UC engines, etc.). </SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"># No. The excess
"fee energy" that would otherwise be wasted includes:</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">1: The sensible
and latent energy in teh gasifier output product gas.</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">2: The sensible
and latent heat in teh engine exhaust after teh fuel gas passed through
teh engine.</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"># I am
not at all talking about "free energy." What I am talking about is, as stated
above, the potential for maximizing energy content of output gas from a given
energy content of biomass feed. More specifically, if there is more water in
the feedstock, its endothermic heat burden on the reaction is increased,
but if there is "waste heat" available, such as hot engine exhaust, it may be
able to recover this waste thermal heat, and feed it into the reaction, to end
up with a greater energy content in the output gas than is presently
attainable. There is no "Something for Nothing" scam here... it is a question
being able to recover waste exhaust heat as chemical energy in the
output gas.</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Even tars require
energy for “cracking” (that’s why catalysts are important). Look at the Gibbs
Free Energy of the fuel infeed and you can compute the theoretical, 100%
efficient (read:impossible!) output. </SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"># Using catalysts
to crack tars for gasification is totally unnecessary. Simply set fire to
them.</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">One may wish to
alter the composition of the output gas, but it ain’t free, baby! </SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"># I would strongly
disagree with you. If the excess waste energy in the hot engine exhaust can be
used to counteract the endothermic heat load of extra water in wet fuel, then
the extra recovered energy is indeed free, from a cost standpoint, but in no
way does it violate the First Law.</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Otherwise I would
be filling the petrol tank on my double-engined Hummer with quadruple A/C with
my garden hose!</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"># No
comment.</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Best
wishes,</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Kevin</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"><o:p></o:p></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Yah!<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Mark<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org
[mailto:gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <B>On Behalf Of
</B>Kevin<BR><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, October 17, 2010 10:43 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification;
gasification@bioenergylists.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Gasification] the most
important thing (quite possibly) i'velearned to
date<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Dear
Jim</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Interesting
thoughts!</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">What are your
thoughts on the optimum moisture content of biomass feed to a gasifier? On the
one hand, with low fuel moisture content, there is a low endothermic load on
teh reaction. On the other hand, a high moisture content could yield greater
hydrogen content in the output gas.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">To take things to
the limit, what are your thoughts on feeding a gasifier with torrified
wood?</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thanks!</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Kevin</SPAN> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">----- Original
Message ----- <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A
title=jim@allpowerlabs.org href="mailto:jim@allpowerlabs.org">jim mason</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">To:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A
title=gasification@bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:gasification@bioenergylists.org">gasification@bioenergylists.org</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Sent:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> Monday, October
18, 2010 2:08 AM<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Subject:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> [Gasification]
the most important thing (quite possibly) i'velearned to
date<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P></DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><BR><BR>there are many
variables to move around in a gasifier, and all of them are<BR>important.
but once the basics are in order, i'm coming to the conclusion that<BR>the
most impactful thing one can do/add/fix to the basic imbert design is to use
<BR>the ic engine exhaust to heat the incoming fuel.<BR><BR>no, i don't have
any numbers on this yet (we hope to get these soon), but the<BR>anecdotal
experiences keep piling up. the biggest flexibility gains i'm
finding<BR>both in poor fuel shape/size and moisture tolerance, as well as
gas turndown ratio, <BR>are from the ic exhaust heat exchanger. on our rig,
this is called the pyrocoil. other<BR>rigs call this something
else.<BR><BR>this is not terribly surprising. the ic exhaust is the biggest
waste heat<BR>source we have around a gasifier. in principle, the ic exhaust
has about about<BR>3x or 4x the heat available as the outgoing syngas. the
incoming fuel similarly<BR>has much more heating capacity than the incoming
air (the multiple i forget at<BR>the moment, but i do know the incoming air
can only take up about 1/2 of the<BR>heat available in the outgoing
syngas).<BR><BR>also, the ic exhaust is much hotter than the outgoing syngas
after preheating<BR>the incoming air. thus you can use the ic exhaust to do
much more than dry the<BR>fuel. you can it to drive the fuel through
pyrolysis, and really, get it up to<BR>about 4-500c before it falls into the
hearth proper. this is a big difference<BR>from the typical situation of
still moist fuel falling into the hearth.<BR><BR>not only can you use the ic
exhaust to add a very significant amount of heat to<BR>the system, you can
also use it to change the character of pyrolysis in the<BR>reactor. a
typical downdraft has very high temp short residence time pyrolysis<BR>right
on top of the nozzles. this high temp pyrolysis optimizes the creation
of<BR>teritary tars, or refractory tars, which are difficult to crack again
(given<BR>lots of double carbon bonds). if you externally drive pyrolysis at
lower temp<BR>over longer time, you get more primary and secondary tars,
which are easier to<BR>crack downstream (fewer double carbon bonds). this
seems to allow hearth<BR>conditions to be less perfect and still get good
gas out.<BR><BR>using ic exhaust to heat incoming fuel is not a complete get
out of jail free<BR>card. but to me it seems the most impactful new thing
one can do on these rigs.<BR>it seems to have more of an impact than any
other single thing we've done to<BR>date on the gek.<BR><BR>yes, all of it
is important, and all of it should be tended to, but the above is<BR>my
current vote for the biggest bang for the effort. hopefully we can get
some<BR>proper numbers on this soon (and prove or disprove the above
conjecture).<BR><BR>jim<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Jim
Mason<BR>Website: <A
href="http://www.whatiamupto.com">http://www.whatiamupto.com</A><BR>Current
Projects: <BR> - Gasifier Experimenters Kit (the GEK): <A
href="http://www.gekgasifier.com">http://www.gekgasifier.com</A><BR>
- Escape from Berkeley alt fuels vehicle race: <A
href="http://www.escapefromberkeley.com">www.escapefromberkeley.com</A><BR>
- ALL Power Labs on Twitter: <A
href="http://twitter.com/allpowerlabs">http://twitter.com/allpowerlabs</A><BR>
- Shipyard Announce list: <A
href="http://lists.spaceship.com/listinfo.cgi/icp-spaceship.com">http://lists.spaceship.com/listinfo.cgi/icp-spaceship.com</A><o:p></o:p></P>
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