<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1" http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META name=GENERATOR content="MSHTML 8.00.6001.19046">
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Dear GF</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>This is very interesting! Would you have any idea
of the search terms to use in the Patent System, to find the patent? Was it a US
or foreign patent? We wouldn't be so lucky that you had a patent number, would
we?? :-)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Thanks!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Kevin</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"
dir=ltr>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=gfwhell@aol.com href="mailto:gfwhell@aol.com">GF</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org">gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, May 20, 2011 1:35 AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Gasification] Underwater
gasification?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT color=black size=2 face=arial>
<DIV>In the 1890's a patent was issued for an invention for the propulsion of
a vessel using the explosion of gas above a column of watet which was forced
out of the vessel</DIV>
<DIV>in the opposite direction to the desired direction of navigation. The
process could be reversed for slowing down purposes. This invention
preceeded Humphrie's pump by about thirty years. A jet propelled vessel
using heated biomass as fuel with only a couple of moving components
sound worthy of investigation.</DIV>
<DIV>I do remember sailing toy boats with a coil of tube as the "engine" with
a candle providing enough heat to boil the water within the coil causing a
pulse jet out back.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>GF</DIV>
<DIV style="CLEAR: both"></DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV
style="FONT-FAMILY: arial,helvetica; COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">-----Original
Message-----<BR>From: Daniel Chisholm <dmc@danielchisholm.com><BR>To:
Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification
<gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org><BR>Sent: Wed, May 18, 2011 9:14
pm<BR>Subject: Re: [Gasification] Underwater gasification?<BR><BR>
<DIV id=AOLMsgPart_2_70d54b2d-07c2-4f02-8904-827eb165cc69>Sam conceptually
speaking you would be using the thermoelectric generators as a "transmission"
of sorts - you are connecting hot flue gas on one side, which the T.E.G. turns
it into electrically generated shaft power on the other side. So the
question becomes whether this is the best way for you to convert heat from
wood into shaft power for your propeller.
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>My initial thoughts are that this is probably not an effective way to get
this done. One issue is that thermoelectric generators are very
inefficient, on the order of 1% or 2% (this means that you need to feed them
50hp or 100hp of thermal energy in order to produce 1hp of electrical power).
Or, the 55,000 btu/hr heat source you quote might be expected to produce
550-1100btu/hr of electrical power (which at 3412btu/hr per kilowatt would be
0.16-0.32kW or about 1/6hp to 1/3hp). In comparison an old fashioned low
pressure simple steam engine will probably give you 5% to 8% efficiency (so
several times more economical of wood than an T.E.G.) and a small gasoline
engine would be on the order of 20% (so wood would have to be 10X or even 20X
cheaper than gasoline, which is quite unlikely</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Another big factor is cost per unit of power, the panel you link to is
$320 for a 30 watt panel, so we are talking about $10,000 per kilowatt
(contrast this to say a 100kW automotive engine that costs say $5000, or a how
much a 10hp (7.5kW) outboard motor might cost).</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Thermoelectric generators have a number of virtues, for example no moving
parts, maintenance free and very long life, quiet operation, etc., which make
them excellent choices for some unusual special applications. But I
expect they are unlikely to be a good match for a principal power source like
boat propulsion.</DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><BR>-- <BR>- Daniel<BR>Fredericton, NB
Canada<BR></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV><!-- end of AOLMsgPart_2_70d54b2d-07c2-4f02-8904-827eb165cc69 -->
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fff; MARGIN: 0px; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, Sans-Serif; COLOR: #000; FONT-SIZE: 12px"
id=AOLMsgPart_3_70d54b2d-07c2-4f02-8904-827eb165cc69><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT>_______________________________________________
Gasification mailing list
to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
<A href="mailto:Gasification@bioenergylists.org">Gasification@bioenergylists.org</A>
to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
<A href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org" target=_blank>http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org</A>
for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site:
<A href="http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/" target=_blank>http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/</A>
</TT></PRE></DIV><!-- end of AOLMsgPart_3_70d54b2d-07c2-4f02-8904-827eb165cc69 --></DIV></FONT>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>Gasification mailing
list<BR><BR>to Send a Message to the list, use the email
address<BR>Gasification@bioenergylists.org<BR><BR>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change
your List Settings use the web
page<BR>http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org<BR><BR>for
more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web
site:<BR>http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/<BR>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>
<P class=avgcert align=left color="#000000">No virus found in this
message.<BR>Checked by AVG - <A
href="http://www.avg.com">www.avg.com</A><BR>Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus
Database: 1509/3647 - Release Date: 05/19/11</P></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>