<html><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div>Mark</div><div><br></div><div>See previous comments on keeping the oxide skin thin. Don't let the powder get hot in the hammer mill.</div><div><br></div><div>Tom Reee<br><br>Dr Thomas B Reed<div>President, The Biomass Energy Foundation</div><div><a href="http://www.Woodgas.com">www.Woodgas.com</a></div></div><div><br>On Jul 12, 2011, at 10:59 PM, "Mark E. Ludlow" <<a href="mailto:mark@ludlow.com">mark@ludlow.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div class="WordSection1"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Dr. Tom,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Can one hammer mill->ball mill the Al into a powder and burn it directly (stand back!)?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Mark<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> <a href="mailto:gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a> [mailto:gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Thomas Reed<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 12, 2011 5:53 PM<br><b>To:</b> Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification; Art Krenzel<br><b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:Gasification@bioenergylists.org"><a href="mailto:Gasification@bioenergylists.org">Gasification@bioenergylists.org</a></a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Gasification] CONSERVATION OF ENERGY<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">PS. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">According to my book, THE FREE ENERGY OF BINARY COMPOUNDS (available at <a href="http://Woodgas.com"><a href="http://Woodgas.com">Woodgas.com</a></a>)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">The Enthalpy of combustion of Al <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Al + 3/2 O2 ==> 1/2 Al2O3. Delta H (C) = 178 kcal/mole = 745 kJ/mole. The MW of Al is 27, so this is 27.6 kJ/g or 12,527 kJ/ lb. 1 kW hr is 3.8 MJ, so this is 3.3 kW hr/lb. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Well worth capturing.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Tom Reed<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><br>Dr Thomas B Reed<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">President, The Biomass Energy Foundation<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.Woodgas.com"><a href="http://www.Woodgas.com">www.Woodgas.com</a></a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>On Jul 12, 2011, at 7:51 PM, GF <<a href="mailto:gfwhell@aol.com"><a href="mailto:gfwhell@aol.com">gfwhell@aol.com</a></a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><div><div id="AOLMsgPart_1_ec7eb326-b5c9-4d13-8d49-1ff6abd4eb36"><div><div id="AOLMsgPart_1_d8a7d03b-426b-4064-8f1f-7f57443426a4"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The other day I posted an article on this site concerning:</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> Cornish Hydrogen Generator. Keelynet, which describes a method of converting</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Aluminum into its oxide and in the process cracks water, freeing up hydrogen for use as fuel for a light car.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">By all accounts, using this gas in the place of any other fuel.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Distances and the amount of metal used in this attainment were mentioned.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I was hoping for a reaction from one of the many “Energy Economists”</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Who lurk on this site, to respond with negative information regarding the impracticality and waste fullness of such a process?</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I believe there is a large following on this site who are interested in obtaining electrical power using renewable energy, derived from carbon neutral sources.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">They might question the economics and ethics of using a refined ore as fuel.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Instead of chopping down oxygen producing vegetation. </span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">In this respect I am a nonconformist. I believe most Aluminum is produced by Hydro electric power and, so the CO2 is not in the equation.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">My second comment is harnessing a “free” supply of high temperature heat which is emitted from most Ice’s in the form of “Hot Exhaust”.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">This is the place to install a reactor capable of converting beer cans into hydrogen as not too much energy would be needed to complete the reaction. Bubbling super heated steam through a molten bath of AL would give pure hydrogen.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">No tar, and the ash is a hot commodity</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The real question is: how much energy is locked up in a pound of AL</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">gfwhell</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>Gasification mailing list<br><br>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br><a href="mailto:Gasification@bioenergylists.org"><a href="mailto:Gasification@bioenergylists.org">Gasification@bioenergylists.org</a></a><br><br>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org"><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org</a></a><br><br>for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site:<br><a href="http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/"><a href="http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/">http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/</a></a><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>Gasification mailing list</span><br><span></span><br><span>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address</span><br><span><a href="mailto:Gasification@bioenergylists.org">Gasification@bioenergylists.org</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page</span><br><span><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site:</span><br><span><a href="http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/">http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>