<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 14 (filtered medium)">
<style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Geneva;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
span.EmailStyle17
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
mso-fareast-language:EN-US;}
@page WordSection1
{size:612.0pt 792.0pt;
margin:3.0cm 2.0cm 3.0cm 2.0cm;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
</head>
<body lang="DA" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Dear All – and Tom <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">There are many challenges to solved before gasifiers are commercial and competitive.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I can only agree to you observations about some fantastic projects with too much money and too little technical competence. These projects are
found every where in the world. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">What is missing in 95 % of the projects I see is that “some body” did not sit down and ask a few simple questions – most important – listened to
the answers. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Why is it so? – I think it is because it would stop 80 % of all projects.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I Denmark we have developed a dozen of small scale gasifiers since 1985. The basic business idea was to take some cheap fuel (100%) and produce
25 % expensive electricity and 50 % cheap heat. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">But - now heat is more expensive than electricity – and the cost level we have reached is 2-10 times the market price.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">And of course none of the plants are no where near a commercial product (apart from one that is close to – but 2-4 times too expensive) because
the investors are looking for projects that have a chance of being competitive with in 2-10 years.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">If I should give (I some times do – but not sure they listen) an investor an advice – would I suggest small scale gasification? - NO<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">If I should give (I do that very often – and I am sure they do not listen) a politician an advice of how to reduce global warming – would I suggest
small scale gasification? – Yes – probably – but I would advice him/her to be sure that the money are invested in such a way that new interesting technologies have higher priority than a smart feature to a fluidbed or an updraft gasifier.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">The consequence of that is that my 10-15 years of biomass gasification know-how is almost only relevant to tell you what not to do – and not what
to do. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Some day something interesting will come – we will only see it if we listen and see.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">It might come from strange EU supported projects or from USA VC financed projects or from a university in Indonesia.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Best regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Thomas
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></i></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Fra:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org [mailto:gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org]
<b>På vegne af </b>LINVENT@aol.com<br>
<b>Sendt:</b> 29. juli 2012 00:59<br>
<b>Til:</b> tmiles@trmiles.com; Doug.Williams@orcon.net.nz; gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org<br>
<b>Emne:</b> Re: [Gasification] Potential Gasification Winner?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black">Dear Tom M,<br>
I think that just because a system operates in EU environs has limited bearing on it's success in the US or other areas because the EU has active gov't support of their renewable energy programs to a much larger degree than here in the US. Also, renewable
energy rates in Italy particularly, are really astronomical and one can afford a lot of costs not tolerated here.
<br>
From my first hand experiece there, the Italian regulatory system is loosey-goosey. The one Italian I was aware of there was arrested, indicted for 28 charges of defrauding the government, held under house arrest pending trial and then the prosecutor dropped
all the charges. I know first hand he and his partner were guilty. <br>
Some of the EU incinerators operate in excess of permitted levels, but are not shut down because there isn't an alternative. One group operated for several years until the investigators found that they had forged the emission analysis and sent two VPs
to jail for doing so and now the $150mm plants are shut down. <br>
When I was there watching a 35mm Euro acid hydrolysis plant being built, I saw them take pipes and weld them together to handle medium pressure steam and did absolutely no testing on the welds, no dye, X-ray, Ultrasonic or other which would never fly here.
I have to admit the guy welding was one of the best I had ever seen, but really? One of the engineers on the plant said that he wasn't going to be there when it started up because he didn't want to see it blow up.
<br>
Some of the EU folks actively seek US products. I have had lots of interest from over there, they have even been willing to take care of the EU registration. Which by the way, one Asian gasifier is registered but does not have any reference to it's electrostatic
precipitator in it's registration documents. Not sure how this is done either. <br>
Sincerely,<br>
Leland T. "Tom" Taylor<br>
President<br>
Thermogenics Inc. <br>
In a message dated 7/28/12 3:58:55 PM, <a href="mailto:tmiles@trmiles.com">tmiles@trmiles.com</a> writes:<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><br>
<br>
Doug,<br>
<br>
Anyone who has the enthusiasm and the where-with-all to reach the manufacturing stage of developing gasifiers should be given the benefit of the doubt. It is a long road. The proof of any claims is the sustained and reliable operation of a commercial system.
Gasifiers installed in the US must meet standards of industrial construction, safety and environmental impact similar to those in Europe, regardless of where they are manufactured. We look forward to seeing third party verified results of their operation.
Then we can line up to buy them. <br>
<br>
AGT and Biogen are private companies. They have been visible at conferences and they have more than one gasifier in operation at least at the 250 kWe scale. They recently installed two 500 kWe gasifiers in Italy near their main offices. It is likely that they
will operate those units for significant periods before they start exporting systems. Like others they have had ups and downs during pilot, small scale and commercial operations. They have been selling projects. We hope that those projects are successful.<br>
<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:blue"><a href="http://www.agtgasification.com/eng/agt_srl.htm"><span lang="EN-US">http://www.agtgasification.com/eng/agt_srl.htm</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:blue"><a href="http://www.biogendr.com/app/en/frontpage.aspx"><span lang="EN-US">http://www.biogendr.com/app/en/frontpage.aspx</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><br>
<br>
<br>
Tom Miles<br>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Gasification mailing list<br>
<br>
to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><a href="mailto:Gasification@bioenergylists.org"><span lang="EN-US">Gasification@bioenergylists.org</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><br>
<br>
to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org"><span lang="EN-US">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><br>
<br>
for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site:<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><a href="http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/"><span lang="EN-US">http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Geneva","serif";color:black"><br>
<br>
<br>
</span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>