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<DIV><FONT size=3>Dear GF</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=GFWHELL@aol.com href="mailto:GFWHELL@aol.com">GFWHELL@aol.com</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org">gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, November 28, 2013 11:51
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Gasification] Fluidised Bed
Reactor</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT id=role_document color=#000000 size=2 face=Arial>
<DIV>Kevin .</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>What sort of reaction could be expected if we applied the high
temperature exhaust from an IC engine into a "reactor" containing biomass and
at the same time reheated the "reactor" using some of the volatile vapors so
produced? </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3># My understanding of exhaust twemperatures is that they run
something as follows: (Anyone who knows better, please correct
me:):</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3>
Unloaded
Loaded</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3>Diesel
~300F=150C
~ 752 F =400C Max</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3>Spark. Ig:
~500F=260C ~752 F
=400C Max</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3>I conclude that even "hot engine exhaust would not be
sufficient to operate the C + CO2 --> 2Co reaction that requires
temperatures in excess of 700C to run.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>perhaps we could also ionize the vapors produced within the reactor
to above 5000 deg. which should yield a relatively low tar stream of gas
.some of which could fuel the IC engine.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3># 5000 F would certainly run the above reaction. However,
"Tars" areof the general formula CxHyOn. Such temperatures would certainly
"partially crack" the tars, but probably would not "crack" them fully, to give
a tar free gas. I am guessing you would end up with some CO, and some other
tars of a different composition. However, they would likely be "heavier tars"
that might be removed more easily.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3># The other issue is the energy required to "ionize" stuff
at 5,000 degrees. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>This does not compromise the laws of Thermodynamics.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3># Exactly! Although many have tried, I don't know of any who
have succeeded.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3>Best wishes,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3>Kevin</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>GF</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>In a message dated 11/28/2013 9:55:19 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
kchisholm@ca.inter.net writes:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px"><FONT
style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" color=#000000 size=2 face=Arial>Dear
Dan<BR><BR>Quoting Carefreeland@aol.com:<BR><BR>> Doug and
all,<BR>> Would some sort of a high temp molecular
cracker be a good companion<BR>> to create a quality gas from a
fluidised bed? Possibly some steam and / or<BR>> preheated air
.involved? Seems if you wrapped the exhaust back through the<BR>>
hottest part of the flame in a reactor tube this can be
accomplished.<BR>> Sorry but I have been kinda outta
the loop for a while.<BR><BR># Start by appreciating the two
Fundamental Rules of Thermodynamics <BR>and Thermo
Chemistry:<BR>Fundamental Rule #1: You can't get something for
nothing<BR>Fundamental Rule #2: As a matter of fact, you can't even break
even.<BR><BR>For example, the reaction<BR>C + O2 --> CO2
(`1)<BR>is strongly exothermic, and gives
off about 14,000 BTU per pound of <BR>carbon that is
oxidized.<BR><BR>If there was insufficient O2, and the C was only burned to
CO, as follows:<BR>C + 1/2O2 --> CO
(2)<BR>then only abut 4,000 BTU would be released per
pound of carbon.<BR><BR>If we wanted to reverse reaction #1, we would have
to put back 14,000 BTU/Lb C<BR>OR, in the case of a gasifier, where the
reaction<BR>CO2 + C --> 2 CO
(3)<BR>is desired, we would have to "put back" energy as
follows:<BR>14,000 + 0 --> 2x4,000 + "X"<BR>14,000 --> 8,000 +
"X"<BR>and it is obvious that "X" is 6,000 BTU, in order to respect
<BR>Fundamental Rule #1<BR><BR>"Molecular Crackers" and "Catalysts" do
indeed work, but only when the <BR>fundamental need to add or remove
energy from a reaction is respected. <BR>As long as the "fundamental
need for an energy balance" is respected, <BR>then many things are
possible.<BR><BR>Best wishes,<BR><BR>Kevin<BR><BR>><BR>>
Dan
Dimiduk<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>Gasification
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