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<div> <span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>Bio Char has limited and spotty benefits to the soil. If the soil is deficient in zinc, adding a carbon plus other materials other than zinc merely dilutes the zinc and hurts the plant, other nutrients suffer similarly. Nitrogen is another victim of the use of bio char as the carbon in it depletes the nitrogen while it is being consumed and converted by the microbes in the soil. </div>
<div><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>The low cation exchange of bio char or compost also limits the nutrient releasing to the plant. </div>
<div><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>It is unfortunate that low carbon conversion gasifiers or pyrolyzers may have to dispose of a major energy source, fixed carbon, in the use of bio char, as it represents some 30% or more of the input energy as fixed carbon to a conversion system. </div>
<div style="font-family:arial;color:black;font-size:10pt;clear:both;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="arial">Sincerely,</font><br>
<div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="'Comic Sans MS', sans-serif">Leland T. "Tom" Taylor</font></div>
<div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">Thermogenics Inc. </font></div>
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-----Original Message-----<br>
From: darius_tamizi <darius_tamizi@hotmail.com><br>
To: Tom Miles <tmiles@trmiles.com>; 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' <gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org><br>
Sent: Tue, Dec 3, 2013 4:34 pm<br>
Subject: Re: [Gasification] Small steam systems plus gasifiers for electricity<br>
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<div>Dear Tom,</div>
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<div>Yes. At the door of our plant in Medan-Indonesia.</div>
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<div>Regards,</div>
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<div>Darius</div>
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<div style="font-size:75%;color:#575757">Terkirim dari Samsung Mobile</div>
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-------- Original message --------<br>
From: Tom Miles <<a href="mailto:tmiles@trmiles.com">tmiles@trmiles.com</a>> <br>
Date: 04/12/2013 06:31 (GMT+07:00) <br>
To: 'darius_tamizi' <<a href="mailto:darius_tamizi@hotmail.com">darius_tamizi@hotmail.com</a>>,'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' <<a href="mailto:gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org">gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>> <br>
Subject: RE: [Gasification] Small steam systems plus gasifiers for electricity <br>
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<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">Darius,</span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">Good price. Delivered where? At the door of your plant in Indonesia? I can’t remember where you are. </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">Tom</span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
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<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"> Gasification [<a href="mailto:gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org?">mailto:gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>darius_tamizi<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, December 03, 2013 3:19 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Gasification] Small steam systems plus gasifiers for electricity</span></div>
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<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal">We can supply biochar for only US$0.25/kg or US$2.5/5gallon</div>
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<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#575757">Terkirim dari Samsung Mobile</span></div>
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-------- Original message --------<br>
From: Tom Miles <<a href="mailto:tmiles@trmiles.com">tmiles@trmiles.com</a>> <br>
Date: 03/12/2013 10:25 (GMT+07:00) <br>
To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' <<a href="mailto:gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org">gasification@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>> <br>
Subject: Re: [Gasification] Small steam systems plus gasifiers for electricity <br>
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<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">Jeff,</span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">Nothing is that sensible. With retail garden products, and especially on eBay, weight and value go out the window. It’s whatever the customer (sucker?) will pay for a package. Garden products are usually sold by volume, not weight. </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">Take the 5 gallon bucket of biochar that weighs 17 lbs. The blend is 25 lb/ft3 (17 lb/0.67 ft3). If the biochar is about 8 lb/ft3 and the additive, say compost, is 42 lb/ft3 then that’s a ~50:50 blend by weight. Is it worth $56? Sip the KoolAid and pay the $56 to support your biochar curiosity. There are some very good biochar-compost blends that sell for far less. </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">I like the Biochar “charflakes” at $129/5 gal or $65/2 gal. $192/ft3 (>$5,000 CY) or $240/ft3? (That 5 gal plastic bucket must be worth more than $2 that I pay.) </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">I’ll take the 40lb bag for $33 ($0.83/lb). That must be a misprint. The same supplier wants $1.80/lb for 10 lb and 2.60/lb for 5 lb. </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">We don’t really know what portion or how much of a market these retail garden products represent but several sharp marketers are taking advantage of it. If you are willing to do the packaging and sales and get a lot more than $1/ft3 then you are at the head of the class. </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">At least eBay makes it easy to find these things on the internet.</span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">Tom</span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
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<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"> Gasification [<a href="mailto:gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">mailto:gasification-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jeff Davis<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, December 02, 2013 4:01 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Gasification] Small steam systems plus gasifiers for electricity</span></div>
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<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> </div>
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<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Tom,<br>
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So, if the charcoal is mixed with compost does some of the compost and water add to the wieght of the charcaol sold?<br>
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Business Model:<br>
Grass compost + moisture + charcoal = X amount of $$$ per pound ????<br>
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Here's a 5 gallon bucket of biochar for a cool $129.00:<br>
<a target="_blank" href="http://www.ebay.com/itm/121104857835"><http://www.ebay.com/itm/121104857835></a><br>
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And more examples:<br>
<a target="_blank" href="http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xbiochar&_nkw=biochar&_sacat=0&_from=R40"><http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xbiochar&_nkw=biochar&_sacat=0&_from=R40></a><br>
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<br>
Jeff<br>
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On 12/01/2013 06:57 PM, Tom Miles wrote:</div>
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<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">There is a lot of creative marketing going on with biochar. There is a wide range of quality. Prices range from $0.35/lb to $2/lb with most selling between $0.75-$1.00/lb ex plant. </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"> </span></div>
<div class="aolmail_MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:">Updraft gasifiers (>10 MWth) have been good sources of char for one biochar wholesaler/broker. Char is usually conditioned with compost or inoculated before it reaches the final customer. As nearly as we can tell a few thousand tons of char was traded in the US in the last year. </span></div>
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<div id="AOLMsgPart_3_224632d6-a6f8-444d-ba66-893250faeef9" style="margin: 0px;font-family: Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, Sans-Serif;font-size: 12px;color: #000;background-color: #fff;"> <pre style="font-size: 9pt;"><tt>_______________________________________________ Gasification mailing list to Send a Message to the list, use the email address <a href="mailto:Gasification@bioenergylists.org">Gasification@bioenergylists.org</a> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page <a target="_blank" href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org</a> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: <a target="_blank" href="http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/">http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/</a> </tt></pre> </div>