<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>Continued;</div><div><b><u>that</u></b> reaction is endothermic. </div><div><br></div><div>H. <br><br><br></div><div><br>On Apr 13, 2015, at 10:45 AM, Henri <<a href="mailto:c_hnaths@telusplanet.net">c_hnaths@telusplanet.net</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><div><span></span></div><div><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><div>Hi Jeff </div><div>The reaction , hence the headline of the discussion, I am referring to is the elimination of Carbon monoxide. </div><div>CO + H2O <=>CO2+H2. That reaction alone is exothermic. Favourable at low temperatures (t<200c)</div><div>I assume you are referring to a charcoal Gasifier. If that be the case, are there not combustible by products from the charcoaling that can be oxidized to maintain the 900c heat needed to gasify the charcoal on steam alone. Because aparently superheated steam plus a char bed of 930c will gasify charcoal and yes <b>that</b></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"><br>Quoting wiki<br></span><h3 class="in-block" style="text-decoration: -webkit-letterpress; margin: 0px; padding: 0.5em 0px; border: 0px; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box; position: relative;"><span class="mw-headline" id="Temperature_dependence" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; font-weight: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box; background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"><font size="3">Temperature dependence</font></span><a href="http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water-gas_shift_reaction#/editor/6" title="Edit section: Temperature dependence" data-section="6" class="icon icon-edit-enabled edit-page icon-32px" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; font-weight: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: url(data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAFAAAABQCAMAAAC5zwKfAAAANlBMVEUAAAD///9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW9sbW+FiFraAAAAEXRSTlMAABAgMEBQYHCAkKCwwNDg8InUWv0AAAGfSURBVHhe7djBjsIgFIXhOwjFeltK3/9lJ4J6SG5dHGgyyaRn1dUXlb8slJ+T9//AC7zACxRiLu37EqXsDPCW9ue2cBLo8/7a/RQwFK9OTwDj3k6Hwbk6Mb/EeRDUojyaHzKMgG4pRmy/ehoAXcklT3h+buoGffU8vDJlQJtfuuG5busEY/Xc28N4EPkp7EHwUaODjSkLIr8Iu/VIELkE2Bj9psDzSBuLQoLIxX1sLEfhQHirQ9rwvLAgcoHdejx4b3IJ8PDOcCBysfklJzToipc9Piu2OKFA5LL5o/xUhAZ9Qi7W40Dkspj8as48OGXkYj0ORH73w/yC8OCMXA5y5sE2lwgPh86Bbi3h+i8506Brc3kYjwb9VkL7lh8N+jaXxXg0GBGayW8WCoSXq+dNzjyIXGx+UXhQm1yCyZkHA8JAfvBosF6h21RvU3vb86B+4lCTcxf4rkTV3PZ9IAiTcxcYvnm94P3Qi9IN6rHXDybL5SAD4IHnZQAMxtu8jIA4E+Q8BKr1xkCcybrOcwhOBsE3JOT+4G+WC7zAC7zAXxMIT+qGYJfyAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC); background-size: 32px; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box; -webkit-background-size: 32px; cursor: pointer; overflow: hidden; min-height: 32px; min-width: 32px; display: inline; top: 0px; bottom: 0px; right: 0px; position: relative; float: right; background-position: 50% 50%;"><font color="#000000" size="3"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Edit</span></font></a></h3><div class="thumb tright" style="margin: 0.6em 0px 0.6em 1.4em; padding: 0px; border: 0px; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box; float: right; clear: right;"><div class="thumbinner" style="margin: 0px auto; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box; width: 402px; max-width: 100% !important;"><br><div class="thumbcaption" style="margin: 0.5em 0px 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box; padding: 0px !important; width: auto !important; float: none !important; clear: both !important;"><br></div></div></div><p style="text-decoration: -webkit-letterpress; margin: 0.5em 0px 1em; padding: 0px; border: 0px; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">The water gas shift reaction is a moderately <a href="http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exothermic_reaction" title="Exothermic reaction" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;">exothermic</a>reversible reaction. Therefore with increasing temperature the reaction rate increases but the conversion of reactants to products becomes less favorable.<sup id="cite_ref-6" class="reference" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box;"><a href="http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water-gas_shift_reaction#cite_note-6" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;"><span style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box;">[</span>6<span style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box;">]</span></a></sup> Due to its exothermic nature, high carbon monoxide conversion is <a href="http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermodynamic_versus_kinetic_reaction_control" title="Thermodynamic versus kinetic reaction control" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;">thermodynamically</a> favored at low temperatures. Despite the thermodynamic favorability at low temperatures, the reaction is <a href="http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermodynamic_versus_kinetic_reaction_control" title="Thermodynamic versus kinetic reaction control" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;">kinetically</a> favored at high temperatures. The water-gas shift reaction is <a href="http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_equilibrium#Effect_of_temperature" title="Chemical equilibrium" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;">sensitive to temperature</a>, with the tendency to shift towards reactants as temperature increases due to <a href="http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Chatelier%27s_principle" title="Le Chatelier's principle" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;">Le Chatelier's principle</a>. Over the temperature range <a href="tel:600%20%E2%80%93%202000" x-apple-data-detectors="true" x-apple-data-detectors-type="telephone" x-apple-data-detectors-result="0">600 – 2000</a> K, the logarithm of the equilibrium constant for the WGSR is given by the following equation:<sup id="cite_ref-Callaghan_3-5" class="reference" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box;"><a href="http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water-gas_shift_reaction#cite_note-Callaghan-3" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;"><span style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;">[</span><span style="font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; box-sizing: border-box;">3</span><span style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; text-decoration: none; box-sizing: border-box;">]</span></a></sup></span></p><p style="text-decoration: -webkit-letterpress; margin: 0.5em 0px 1em; padding: 0px; border: 0px; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: none; box-sizing: border-box;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"><img class="mwe-math-fallback-image-inline tex" alt="\log_{10} K_\mathrm{eq} = -2.4198 + 0.0003855T + \frac{2180.6}{T}" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/8/4/d/84d79b370b77db76687a492c9a930228.png" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; vertical-align: middle; background-image: none; display: inline-block; box-sizing: border-box; text-align: -webkit-center;"></span></p><br></div><div><br>On Apr 13, 2015, at 9:05 AM, Jeff Davis <<a href="mailto:jeffdavis0124@gmail.com">jeffdavis0124@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><p dir="ltr">If the gasifier is air blown with some steam added the reaction will remain exothermic. If the gasifier is brought up to temp with air and then switched to steam blown then the reaction will be endothermic on pure steam and will need to be toggled back to air blown hence town gas.<br><br></p>
<p dir="ltr">Jeff<br><br><br></p>
<p dir="ltr">______________________________________________<br>
"Once an owner has got used to charcoal gas he will never revert to the more expensive fuels", Geo Bray</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Apr 12, 2015 9:37 PM, "Viswanathan KS" <<a href="mailto:viswanathanks@gmail.com">viswanathanks@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Dr Karve wrote<div>Quote</div><div>--------. <span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">When hot charcoal is treated with steam, it produces coal</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">gas, consisting of a mixture of carbon monoxide and hydrogen. We have</span><br style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">used this reaction in an experimental stove, in which the coal gas is</span><br style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">used as fuel. Can anybody suggest a simple method of removing carbon</span><br style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">monoxide from coal gas?</span><br></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">Unquote</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">Is this reaction sustainable or will the charcoal fire get extinguished due to prolonged passage of steam?</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">The answer to this question should determine the continuation of the discussion.</span></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Apr 13, 2015 at 6:54 AM, Henri Naths <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:c_hnaths@telusplanet.net" target="_blank">c_hnaths@telusplanet.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div><p style="color:rgba(0,0,0,0.701961);text-decoration:-webkit-letterpress">Hello Anand</p><p style="color:rgba(0,0,0,0.701961);text-decoration:-webkit-letterpress"><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Some of the CO can be removed using the water gas reaction. This well known stoichiometry of the water the water-gas shift reaction is : co+h20 <=>h2+co2+heat ( exothermic)</span></p><p style="color:rgba(0,0,0,0.701961);text-decoration:-webkit-letterpress"><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">In an efficient heat integrated scheme , the heat of the reaction can be recovered as superheated high pressure steam.</span></p><span><font color="#888888"><p style="color:rgba(0,0,0,0.701961);text-decoration:-webkit-letterpress"><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">H. </span></p><p style="color:rgba(0,0,0,0.701961);text-decoration:-webkit-letterpress"><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></p><br><br></font></span></div><div><div><div><br>On Apr 11, 2015, at 9:14 PM, Anand Karve <<a href="mailto:adkarve@gmail.com" target="_blank">adkarve@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>Coal gas as automotive fuel</span><br><span>Agriculture, forests and urban centres in India produce annually</span><br><span>about 1000 million tons of combustible waste biomass. Its energy</span><br><span>content is almost 3 times as much as the petroleum that we currently</span><br><span>use in our country. Samuchit Enviro Tech developed a simple and</span><br><span>nonpolluting technology for converting combustible biomass into</span><br><span>charcoal. When hot charcoal is treated with steam, it produces coal</span><br><span>gas, consisting of a mixture of carbon monoxide and hydrogen. We have</span><br><span>used this reaction in an experimental stove, in which the coal gas is</span><br><span>used as fuel. Can anybody suggest a simple method of removing carbon</span><br><span>monoxide from coal gas?</span><br><span>Yours</span><br><span>A.D.Karve</span><br><span></span><br><span>***</span><br><span>Dr. A.D. 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