[Greenbuilding] Redoing all floors

Anncha anncha1 at aol.com
Wed Jul 27 22:38:04 CDT 2011


I don't understand why anyone would seal the stained floors. Waxing is  
so much nicer, it gives a beautiful warm glow. I did my floors ten  
years ago, waxed them
and was told to wax them every year, did that once but have never  
bothered again. I am so happy with them and get compliments all the  
time.

Anncha

Anncha Briggs, ASID/ASRID
AR State Registered Interior Designer #2001
NCIDQ Certificate #015650
design and art consultation
T 501 663 1016

E anncha1 at aol.com

Please consider the environment before printing this email.

On Jul 27, 2011, at 5:34 PM, Ktot (g) wrote:

> I can't imagine the dark stains that are peeling up are white based,  
> but I'm no stain expert and (another problem) the contractor refuses  
> to tell me the brand/name of stain used (other than it's water-based).
>
> What do you mean "the concrete was never acid etched before using  
> the sealer"? I don't believe anything was done after staining before  
> sealing other than waiting a few days. What is the etching that  
> should have been done--how is it done, etc.? This could be useful in  
> further documenting the problems (since ultimately the contractor IS  
> going to be paying for my new floor, though probably not by their  
> choice).
>
> Also can you explain more about shot blasting? You say it's more  
> cost-effective, but how does it compare to grinding as far as time  
> involved, how much it's going to totally mess up my house, etc.? No  
> one's mentioned this yet but it sounds like something I should look  
> into, especially since sealer removal will be required whether I go  
> with more concrete staining or with tile (or something else I  
> haven't yet considered). We're talking about 1500 sq. ft. in  
> multiple rooms and hallways.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Andrew Pace
> To: Green Building
> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2011 5:23 PM
> Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] Redoing all floors
>
> Non-acid stains like soy stains or polymer stains only sit on the  
> surface and in some of the macro-pores of the concrete.  Acid stain  
> works by chemically reacting with the free lime in the concrete and  
> the salts in the stain, to physically alter the chemistry of the  
> concrete, thus changing the color.  The white you see could be a  
> white base stain, or, it could be that the concrete was never acid  
> etched before using the sealer.  Acid etching removes the “cream”  
> off the surface of the concrete.  This is the fine white or grey  
> powder that will eventually dust off the surface.  Without removing  
> the cream, any coating or topical stain will eventually peel off the  
> surface, since its only sticking to dust.
>
> Grinding and shot blasting are two different ways to achieve the  
> same end result.  It its a large area, shot blasting will be more  
> cost effective and will require less prep before the next coating is  
> applied.
>
>
> Andrew Pace
> Green Design Center®
> Waukesha, WI
>
>
>
> On 7/27/11 5:05 PM, "Ktot (g)" <ktottotc at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I have been told water-based stain--which was used to get the  
> mottled creative pattern that was intended (without white blooms)-- 
> does not sink into the concrete like acid-stain does. Either way,  
> where the stain and sealer have pulled up, there's plain white. It's  
> chalky. Numerous concrete contractors had no idea what that was,  
> telling me my contractor must have done a white layer of stain  
> first, which I knew was not the case. One finally pointed out it's  
> calcium carbonate that chemically reacted to something (the diesel/ 
> propane fuel? the exterior stain that was used indoors [as I later  
> found out]?) That makes sense to me as one gets white on the finger  
> when rubbing those areas. The white areas are all white--the stain  
> has completely lifted up. So it does not seem to have gone down into  
> the concrete--unless there is more under the calcium carbonate.
>
> Also I should have mentioned earlier much of the sealer seems to  
> have disappeared. When put down it was very shiny (as it was  
> supposed to remain) but now in many areas there appears to be little  
> or no sealer (this is from work done two months ago), and one  
> contractor commented the sealer is soft (vs. it supposedly the  
> hardest, most durable there is per my contractor who clearly misled  
> me in numerous ways).
>
> Per the sealer tech rep, the sealer does need to be removed whether  
> I go with concrete again or with tile. He seems to lean towards  
> grinding to remove it. Is that the same as the shot blast you mention?
>
>
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