[Greenbuilding] "Ecoshel" anyone?

Thu Jun 23 18:11:32 CDT 2011

Scouring brings up its own issues in the pnw. We don't have a huge soil
structure in the woods and there is concern here that the forests are a net
equation i.e. that what is seemingly dead on the forest floor is very much
part of what is also standing. Chris Masers redesigned forest is a good read
on that.

There is another issue with the use of wood products on roof (not fire which
is also an issue). Traditionally shake roofs lasted because there was
essentially nothing underlaying them. With older barn shake roofs you could
literally see through them. Dirt debris was free to fall through and lots of
air circulation. When the codes changed to require an underlayment roofers
would joke that the roof was warranted for as long as the tar paper lasted.
At this point you could say that they will last as long as the preservative
treatments (in addition to the tarpaper) as the roofs basically rot.

Fibre cement has pretty well disappeared here as a roofing product (subject
to some of the same moisture/deterioration problems as the native wood).
I've found that as excited as I was about roofing alternatives coming on to
the market over the last 20 years very few of the ones that interested me
are still around. The only big advance has been metal roofing that conceals
the fasteners (duh) and perhaps some commercial sheet or membrane products
that marginally greener and hence more viability for a greener green roof.

John

JOHN SALMEN ENVIRONMENTAL DESIGN

station design & millwork

4465 UPHILL RD DUNCAN BC V9L6M7 250-748-7672 C 250-246-8541 F 250-748-7612

From: greenbuilding-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org
[mailto:greenbuilding-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf Of Tim
Vireo Keating
Sent: June-22-11 8:36 PM
To: Green Building
Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] "Ecoshel" anyone?

At this point, FSC is practically meaningless when it comes to determining
whether logging is sustainable or not, given all the certifications by
FSC-accredited certifiers in old growth. While it would be nice, I highly
doubt that this particular company is among the very, very few that are
accessing WRC from folks who are out there scouring the forest floor for
already-downed trees. But I'd sure love to hear that that is indeed the
case.

tim keating

At 10:36 AM -0400 6/22/11, Matt Dirksen wrote:

Thank you for your opinions about the product. While my understanding is the
company is legit when it comes to FSC certification, I am still wondering if
it is still a better way to recommend fiber cement over cedar. From a
durability perspective, my sense tells me the fiber cement will last longer.
It just seems that the newer cedar products won't hold up like the
"old-growth" products. On the other hand, I imagine old cedar still has a
potential for re-use where I could only hope fiber cement could be diverted
from the landfill.

At the end of the day: do I want to support more killing of trees, or
digging up of the earth.... or both. (sigh). I'd suspect both the trees and
the earth are tired of this giveaway by now.

Matt

On Mon, Jun 20, 2011 at 8:04 PM, Chris Koehn <chris at koehn.com> wrote:

Matt,

I'm not familiar with this product in particular. While Tim's admonishment
about old growth sources may be applicable, you won't know for sure without
asking a few questions of the supplier. The site does claim to use salvaged
logs and FSC logs.
FYI There is a vibrant business in B.C. cutting shakes from stumps of old
growth trees that were felled long ago. Shake blockers do this work, often
working deep in the bush, using helicopters to take the blocks out. There is
also much salvageable red cedar in log form lying in the bush. Until the
middle of the last century, most cedar was felled and abandoned to simply
get it out of the way so that higher value douglas fir could be accessed.
Just Saturday I was walking in the bush and came across three enormous cedar
logs that had been felled at least 50 years ago: there's still plenty of
salvageable wood in the centre of these logs.
Western red cedar is an amazingly durable material, and if it can be
procured from sustainable sources, it can be a good choice.

Chris
TimberGuides
Vancouver Island

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measure of our bodies are the same..."

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