[Greenbuilding] Insulating 140 Year Old Wood Framed Brick Facade Building

Fri Jun 14 19:57:11 CDT 2013

Thanks Alan and RT.
Just to clarify what you are saying Alan.  The soft brick does let moisture
through (the owners are working on eliminating the moisture issues that are
currently present from roof leaks, window details and an existing gutter
system) and spalling is occurring. Not on the scale that RT mentioned but
from 3 stories up a chunk of brick could put a good dent in your dome. This
past winter there was frost and ice on the interior of the building along
with a 2 story moss patch from the downspout anchors.
But back to air sealing.  I should have brought up the lack of a drainage
plane in the description and I find the issue problematic and according to
Building Science Corporation (as well as the US-DOE and the Building
America site) the building is in a cold climate (
http://www.buildingscience.com/doctypes/enclosures-that-work/etw-building-profiles)
and when Alan says:

> I'd be inclined to omit these membranes altogether, and go with an
> airtight-ish drywall or plaster finish, coated with latex primer and paint,
> to achieve the maximum possible permeability.

are you recommending against rigid insulation over the studs to allow
permeability and drying to the inside?
We could easily install 5.5" thick (R-23 US) rockwool and still have an
inch + clearance between the insulation and brick which would be a decent
outcome compared to the wood planks and lathe, which is the current
insulation but wouldn't address thermal bridging of the studs and there are
a lot of studs at 1' on center.  With insulation and "air tight-ish" wall
covering it would likely improve the comfort of the interior space greatly
but wouldn't necessarily be energy efficient.

There is a ground loop geo-thermal system installed but have yet to get the
particulars of it and am not overly familiar working with them.

Thanks for your time

Sam

On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 10:47 AM, Alan Abrams <alan at abramsdesignbuild.com>wrote:

> I agree with RT that the air barrier should occur in at the interior, but
> given the porousity of vintage brick and other elements, would select the
> most permeable material possible for that purpose.  Intello has a
> fabric-like product that resists vapor diffusion into the wall in winter,
> and allows drying to the interior in summer.  that might be appropriate for
> your climate, but it also assumes mechanical dehumidification in warm
> weather.
>
> given the absence of an effective drainage plane and the effects of vapor
> drive to the interior when sunlight hits rainsoaked bricks, I'd be inclined
> to omit these membranes altogether, and go with an airtight-ish drywall or
> plaster finish, coated with latex primer and paint, to achieve the maximum
> possible permeability.
>
> Alan Abrams*
> **certified professional building designer, AIBD
> certified passive house consultant, PHIUS*
> *certified passive house builder, PHIUS**
> *Abrams Design Build LLC
> *sustainable design for intentional living*
> 6411 Orchard Avenue Suite 102
> Takoma Park, MD 20912
> office  301-270-NET- ZERO (301-270-6380)
> fax      301-270-1466
> cell     202-437-8583
> alan at abramsdesignbuild.com
> www.abramsdesignbuild.com
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 8:57 AM, RT <archilogic at yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 13 Jun 2013 22:01:12 -0400, Sam Ewbank <g.l.ewbank at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>   If we don't reinstall the sheething we would need to install
>>> some other sheer bracing (the sheething boards vary in width from 8" to
>>> 30"
>>> and material including cherry, poplar and butter nut).
>>> What about air sealing? Trying to seal the existing sheething would be
>>> difficult to say the least. Would the gypsum plaster be adequate?
>>>
>>
>> Sorry. When I mentioned that the plank sheathing should be salvaged, I
>> just assumed that it would be re-purposed or sold.
>>
>> Whatever function it's currently serving in the structure can be done
>> better
>> by some cheaper, 21st C sheathing material.
>>
>> Old, wide, dry hardwood planks, never exposed to weather would probably be
>> the equivalent of gold in the decor market.
>>
>> It was also assumed that the plank sheathing and wood lath (total
>> thickness 1.5" or so ) would be replaced with something that would provide
>> functions of continuous air barrier, shear bracing and possibly more
>> R-value. (You had mentioned rigid ins.)
>>
>> If I were doing it, I'd consider creating the air barrier plane (possibly
>> OSB or board insulation + let-in bracing ... joints sealed) on the
>> interior face of the studs, taking care to ensure continuity across the
>> joists-balloon studs junction (ie moisture piggy-backed on air leakage
>> could be the Kiss of Death for the brick veneer. ie wet brick no longer
>> kept warm by heat loss would be subject to frost action that result in
>> spalling that could look like the building had been in a war zone and hit
>> by artillery fire.)
>>
>> Then any services (plumbing, electrical)  that needs to go in the exterior
>> walls could be installed on the interior of the air barrier without any
>> concerns about sub-trades compromising the A/B's integrity.
>>
>> 3-coat, wet applied plaster can be an effective air barrier material but
>> maintaining the continuity of the air barrier across the stud/joists
>> junction would still be an issue that needs to be addressed.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> === * ===
>> Rob Tom                                 AOD257
>> Kanata, Ontario, Canada
>>
>> < A r c h i L o g i c  at  Y a h o o  dot  c a  >
>> (manually winnow the chaff from my edress if you hit "reply")
>>
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-- 
Sam Ewbank

*Nature is trying very hard to make us succeed, but nature does not depend
on us. We are not the only experiment.-Buckminster Fuller*
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