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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>SCRUNCH – I think that is the sound that an
optimistically labelled ‘high density’ roxul board makes when you step on it
and your foot compresses it by a few inches.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Or it could be the expression your face
makes when after ‘scrunching’ the board with your foot a nasty cloud of fibres
and formaldehyde fill the air.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I had a stucco contractor substitute a similar
drainage wrap (spun polyolefin). I wasn’t too keen on it as it was one of these
horizontal rain hillside 3 story exposures. The material is so coarse that all
I can imagine it doing is holding or directing water against both the sheathing
and the stucco. Also you end up with a lot of fasteners all over the place
(then doubled with the stucco mesh going over). It looked pretty scrunchy,
especially when it had to be cut into small strips to fill in areas. Also it
was pricey. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Roxul makes a 1” drainboard that could be
used and it at least offers some insulation value (but with air and water
flow?). Same problem with holding water though and the only thing that is going
to dry it is ventilation air. It is about 6lb density and probably would have
to be run between furring. Not sure how that would comply with code for open
area on 16” spacing (and then there is all that urea formaldehyde stiffening
those fibers) <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Sorry for confusion about battens – they are
not banned but the code requirement here (if someone is being a pain) is 1”
nail penetration – so one inch strapping if you are putting it over foam. So
for 3” of exterior foam you need to fasten 1” battens with a min. 5” fastener
thru to the framing – and then secure cladding to that with full 1” depth
fasteners. Basically gets unworkable.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Green guard has another drainmat product
that is a dimpled xps sheet ¼” thick that is run over a wrb that is continuous channels
rather than a spun mat<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoAutoSig><u><font size=3 color=green face="Gill Sans MT"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Gill Sans MT";color:green'>JOHN SALMEN
ENVIRONMENTAL DESIGN<o:p></o:p></span></font></u></p>
<p class=MsoAutoSig><st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on"><i><font
size=2 color=black face="Gill Sans MT"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Gill Sans MT";color:black;font-style:italic'>4465 UPHILL RD</span></font></i></st1:address></st1:Street><i><font
size=2 color=black face="Gill Sans MT"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Gill Sans MT";color:black;font-style:italic'>,. <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">DUNCAN</st1:place></st1:City>, B.C. <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">CANADA</st1:place></st1:country-region>, V9L 6M7<o:p></o:p></span></font></i></p>
<p class=MsoAutoSig><i><font size=2 color=black face="Gill Sans MT"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Gill Sans MT";color:black;font-style:italic'>PH
250 748 7672 FAX 250 748 7612 CELL 250 246 8541<o:p></o:p></span></font></i></p>
<p class=MsoAutoSig><st1:PersonName w:st="on"><i><font size=2 color=black
face="Gill Sans MT"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Gill Sans MT";
color:black;font-style:italic'>terrain@shaw.ca</span></font></i></st1:PersonName><i><font
size=2 color=black face="Gill Sans MT"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Gill Sans MT";color:black;font-style:italic'><o:p></o:p></span></font></i></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org
[mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Alan Abrams<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> October 15, 2010 12:55 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">ArchiLogic@chaffyahoo.ca</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b>
greenbuilding@lists.bioenergylists.org<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [Greenbuilding] wall
envelope - rainscreen</span></font><span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>SCRUNCH <span
style='visibility:visible' id=search>(skr</span></font><font
face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span style='font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode"'>ʌ</span></font>nt<font
face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><span style='font-family:"Lucida Sans Unicode"'>ʃ</span></font>)
</span>V.T. To deform an object, posture, or face, by some means of
compression, distortion, bad taste or smell, etc.<br>
<br>
the "ban" was the prohibition against hanging siding from furring
strips over foam, in John Salmen territory. <br>
<br>
Speaking of John, who, as <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Lincoln</st1:place></st1:City>
would have it, is "the one who commenced this fuss" -- my project
manager just walked in a few hours ago and handed me a brochure for
"RainDrop Green Guard Building Wrap" by Pactiv. <br>
<br>
The product is "scrunched" in some fashion to provide drainage
channels, "no matter how tightly cladding is nailed to the
wall." 16 perms. 15 mils thick.<br>
<br>
There you have it.<br>
<br>
AA<br>
<br>
<br>
<br clear=all>
<b><font color="#006600"><span style='color:#006600;font-weight:bold'>Alan
Abrams<br>
Abrams Design Build LLC</span></font></b><font color="#006600"><span
style='color:#006600'><br>
<i><span style='font-style:italic'>A sustainable approach to beautiful space</span></i><br>
</span></font><font size=1 color="#006600"><span style='font-size:7.5pt;
color:#006600'><a href="mailto:alan@abramsdesignbuild.com" target="_blank"><font
color="#3333ff"><span style='color:#3333FF'>alan@abramsdesignbuild.com</span></font></a></span></font><font
size=1 color="#3333ff"><span style='font-size:7.5pt;color:#3333FF'><br>
</span></font><font size=1 color="#006600"><span style='font-size:7.5pt;
color:#006600'><a href="http://www.abramsdesignbuild.com" target="_blank"><font
color="#3333ff"><span style='color:#3333FF'>www.abramsdesignbuild.com</span></font></a><br>
</span></font><b><font size=2 color="#006600"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
color:#006600;font-weight:bold'>202-726-5894 o<br>
202-437-8583 c<br>
202-291-0626 f</span></font></b><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>On Fri, Oct 15, 2010 at 9:55 AM, RT <<a
href="mailto:ArchiLogic@yahoo.ca">ArchiLogic@yahoo.ca</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>On Fri, 15 Oct 2010
08:52:40 -0400, Alan Abrams <<a href="mailto:alan@abramsdesignbuild.com"
target="_blank">alan@abramsdesignbuild.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>would the roxul in this case be rigid<br>
enough to scrunch down furring strips against its surface, and stay like<br>
that for a while, to support horizontal siding?<br>
<br>
this of course presumes the ban against furring over exoinsulation does not
have a lot of merit.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
Huh ? "Scrunch" ? Vass iss dis "scrunch" ? Don't know
"scrunch". (Sounds like a sugary kiddies breakfast cereal)<br>
<br>
And "ban against furring over outsulation" ? I didn't know there was
a ban.<br>
<br>
But taking a stab into the dark...<br>
<br>
Would the word "Z-channels" be of any use here ?<br>
<br>
(They are often used here in MooseLand with the semi-rigid mineral wool boards
to provide attachments for siding.)<br>
<br>
WRT the ban on furring strips:<br>
<br>
What is the intent of the ban ? Does it have to do with concerns about creating
leetle chimneys for fire that would schwoop up and make short work of foamed
plast-eccchh! outsulation and then result in the whole exterior falling off in
a spectacular flaming mess ? (I just made that up but it sounds pretty
good. Eh ?)<br>
<br>
If so, the ban may not apply to Roxul since it doesn't burn and the use of
Z-channels would make the point moot anyway since there would be no air gap.<br>
<br>
-- <br>
=== * ===<br>
Rob Tom<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Kanata</st1:City>, <st1:State w:st="on">Ontario</st1:State>,
<st1:country-region w:st="on">Canada</st1:country-region></st1:place><br>
< A r c h i L o g i c at Y a h o o dot c a ><br>
manually winnow the chaff from my edress if you hit "reply"<br>
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