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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Lee- I would agree with you but only if municipalities charged water use rates which incorporated true life cycle costs. This also implies that the “used” water when discharged from the waste water treatment plants is as good or better “quality” (AS AFFECTS ANY SUBSEQUENT USE NOT RELYING ON DILUTION) as when it was extracted from the source. Unfortunately too many municipalities have been relying on the “assimilative capacity” (dilution and natural microbial processes ) of the waters receiving the “treated waste water” to finish the cleanup. In most cases we have exceeded this assimilative capacity many years ago and politicians are not willing to charge and spend what it will take to bring the system back into balance unless there is an immediate public health crisis in their jurisdiction and even then the cheapest and fastest bandade solution is often taken –just add more chlorine! <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>If we were to make the decision to upgrade our municipal infrastructures in the US to where they should be in the next decade (and assuming the skilled people were available) unemployment would virtually disappear and the country would be bankrupt and the politicians who made the decisions would be out of office and we would be right back where we started. It is a lot simpler and politically safer to legislate the size of shower heads! i.e reduce consumption.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Don<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org [mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>lee Weaver<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, May 17, 2011 10:01 PM<br><b>To:</b> Green Building<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Greenbuilding] low flow shower heads<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>So then if you are on municipal water systems and are willing to pay for the water and sewer you are then helping the economy (providing jobs for the power, water, and sewer company workers) the water used by the shower will not be polluted to the point that the sewer system will not be able to return it to the aquifer. <br><br>I still fail to see why "<span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Goudy Old Style","serif"'>The planet cannot afford such individuals with little regard for the rest of us." is a valid stance on this topic when all it does it remove a portion of water from availability for a time, it is returned. It even helps a number of people if you take into account all the people working in the field of supplying the water and energy(if you are on municipal services).</span><br><br>Lee<br>On 5/17/2011 6:43 PM, Reuben Deumling wrote: <o:p></o:p></p><pre>Not really that simple.<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>For most of us on municipal water systems there's a lot of<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>infrastructure, energy, pipes, trucks, pumps, chlorine, filters on<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>this incoming end, and a similar but even more complicated and<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>expensive infrastructure on the sewer end. All that costs money and<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>materials to install and maintain and operate.<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>Back in the seventies Amory Lovins figured out that if you back a kWh<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>through the appliance, wires, transmission lines to the power plant<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>and back to the mine, not using that kWh actually translates into a<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>far greater upstream investment that isn't required. Whether it is a<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>factor of 4 or 10 isn't really the point. The same holds true for<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>water except the units and losses are different.<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>The water molecules are still there, but they're always there even<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>after they are polluted or not recharged in the aquifer from which<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>they were pumped. Where the water is, whether it is drinkable, all of<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>this is important.<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 6:36 PM, lee Weaver <a href="mailto:lgweaver@gmail.com"><lgweaver@gmail.com></a> wrote:<o:p></o:p></pre><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><pre>Why<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>The water goes right back into the ground. it's not like that water is<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>destroyed.<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>now trying to start a fight I'm truly asking a valid (IMHO) question.<o:p></o:p></pre></blockquote><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Greenbuilding mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="mailto:Greenbuilding@bioenergylists.org">Greenbuilding@bioenergylists.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/greenbuilding_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/greenbuilding_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>