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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple style='word-wrap: break-word;-webkit-nbsp-mode: space;-webkit-line-break: after-white-space'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>This is a GREAT line! It made me feel so good when I hung my sheets out on the clothes line this afternoon! <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Kathy Cochran<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>San Andreas, California<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org [mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>natural building<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, August 29, 2011 6:50 PM<br><b>To:</b> Green Building<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Greenbuilding] drying clothes<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>What a wonderful analogy: You don't have a clothes dryer therefore you must be poor!<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Does the same apply if I don't have an electric toothbrush, or if the cat-flap isn't automated, or if I actually have to manually push buttons on my heating system thermostat?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Wow I never realised how 'poor' I am! :)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>But funny how good it feels!<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>In jest...<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-style-span><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Papyrus;color:#630AFF'>Steve Satow</span></span><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Papyrus;color:#630AFF'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Papyrus;color:#630AFF'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Papyrus;color:#630AFF'><a href="http://www.naturalbuildingsite.net">www.naturalbuildingsite.net</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Papyrus;color:#630AFF'><a href="mailto:naturalbuilding@shaw.ca">naturalbuilding@shaw.ca</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On 2011-08-29, at 5:09 PM, Benjamin Pratt wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>"Most of the world doesn't use clothes dryers and somehow they manage."<br><br>Not a great argument. Much of the people in the world don't have<br>toilets, are malnourished, don't use birth control, don't have access<br>to an education or healthcare, etc ,etc, etc. Most of the people dn't<br>manage--at least their lives could be a whole lot better if there<br>were any justice in the world....<br>I know those things are a lot more important than wrinkles. I'm just<br>trying to say that telling anyone that they should live as if they are<br>poor is not realistic. Or maybe it's what we need to save the<br>planet--A huge worldwide depression leading to disease and a huge<br>reduction of the population<br>Ben<br><br><br><br><br>On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 2:34 PM, <a href="mailto:candtcampbell@juno.com">candtcampbell@juno.com</a><br><<a href="mailto:candtcampbell@juno.com">candtcampbell@juno.com</a>> wrote:<br><br><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>I have not experimented with different detergents. My clothes are almost<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>exclusively cotton and the city water probably is medium hard. But if I were<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>to put a pair of blue jeans out to dry on a rack, I would expect the jeans<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>to be so stiff when dry that they would almost stand by themselves.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>Hm. You say you 'would expect' this. And I sense that your expectation would<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>be that this state of affairs would be unacceptable. I wonder if you tried<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>it (the drying on a rack, and putting the clothes on afterward) and report<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>back. Most of the world doesn't use clothes dryers and somehow they manage.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>I didn't say I couldn't manage. I'm trying to avoid potential problems before I consider investing in equipment.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>And badly wrinkled too. Underwear, flannel shirts and T shirts would fare no<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>better.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>I've washed all my laundry cold and dried it on the rack everywhere I've<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>lived. I've also never ironed anything except, very rarely, a shirt. I don't<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>go to weddings that often. I suppose I've been missing out all these years,<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>but honestly I'm not sure what the problem is that you've conjured in your<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>mind.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>As problems go, wrinkles are pretty insignificant. But if I can avoid them, I will, just to be socially acceptable.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>that is not my experience with blue jeans and cotton shirts, and I've been<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>hanging clothes on the line for a long time.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>Bob Waldrop, OKC<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>If you are hanging outdoors, I would think that the breeze blowing would deal well with the wrinkles. But I would also think that you risk soiling by birds and insects.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>Nor mine. Nothing is stiff, and most of the wrinkles hang out. Most of the >clothes are cotton.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>Don't the clothespins themselves create pinch marks?<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>(If you hang the shirts and pants upside down, and use 2 pins at the bottom >corners, there's often no need for an iron.)<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>Excellent tip, thanks.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>Charles<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>Greenbuilding mailing list<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><a href="mailto:Greenbuilding@bioenergylists.org">Greenbuilding@bioenergylists.org</a><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/greenbuilding_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/greenbuilding_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><br>-- <br><br><br>b e n j a m i n p r a t t<br><br>professor art+design<br>the university of wisconsin stout<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Greenbuilding mailing list<br>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br><a href="mailto:Greenbuilding@bioenergylists.org">Greenbuilding@bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br>http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/greenbuilding_lists.bioenergylists.org<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><hr size=1 width="100%" noshade style='color:#A0A0A0' align=center></div><p class=avgcert>No virus found in this message.<br>Checked by AVG - <a href="http://www.avg.com">www.avg.com</a><br>Version: 10.0.1392 / Virus Database: 1520/3866 - Release Date: 08/29/11<o:p></o:p></p></div></body></html>