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--></style><title>Re: [Greenbuilding] Black Locust instead of
Ipe</title></head><body>
<div>Honey locust is considered by the Forest Service Forest Products
Lab to be "fairly durable" and black locust to be
"extremely durable". That said, some of the mills with whom
I've worked have said that their experience has them believing that
honey locust is "very" durable. don't 'buy' it myself,
given the milling properties of black locust.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>One can easily tell the difference if one sees the tree before
cutting. Black locust is the one with the drooping white blossoms in
June (which are edible and quite tasty, btw).</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>tim</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I've used Locust for decks, railings, and
outdoor tables; it's great. Perhaps kiln drying causes
stress:</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>everything I've worked with has been
ar dried, and has been fairly stable. My problem is, I don't
know</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Black Locust from Honey Locust, or how
much it matters.</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Clarke Olsen</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>373 route 203</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Spencertown, NY 12165</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>USA</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>518-392-4640</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><a
href="mailto:colsen@fairpoint.net">colsen@fairpoint.net</a></blockquote
>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>On Dec 7, 2011, at 9:01 PM, Tim Vireo
Keating wrote:</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Sacie, et al,</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I apologize for the delay in responding
to this. As David mentioned, I have been working on this for some time
but have been swamped.</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Years ago, black locust was used for
wagon wheel hubs, "trunnels" ("tree nails" for
nailing wooden ship hulls to the beams), occasionally for ship hulls,
for insulator pins on telegraph poles and sometimes for the poles
themselves.These days, the wood is still (occasionally) used for
certain parts of wooden boats but, as you say, mostly used for fence
posts.</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I have been recommending black locust as
an alternative to tropical hardwoods to companies and municipalities
for about five years. The use of this material in Brooklyn Bridge
Park, where I campaigned for two years against the use of ipê, is a
direct result of my advocacy - as it is in Central Park and by NYC
Parks Department in general.</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I firmly believe that black locust can
provide an excellent alternative to tropical hardwoods in applications
where durability vis-a-vis resistance to moisture and bacterial
breakdown is an issue. This includes decks (including the rails),
porches, exterior posts, sill plates, fencing, siding and even roofing
shingles (should one attempt to go with wood, as they did in the old
days).</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I have been working for some time to be
able to provide these profiles to users. Indeed, I had convinced at
least one municipality to order the wood for their boardwalk
renovation project more than a year ago, but they ended up buying the
wood from a supplier that sold them 'log run', which was not suitable
for a municipal boardwalk.</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>There is no doubt that, for many
applications, using black locust has its challenges. I believe these
can be overcome with some application of intelligence and I am working
on doing this right now. It's very important to understand the
realities of this wood, especially in regards to the size of the
trees, their tendency to twist as they grow and the tendency of the
wood to move as it's milled and after. It's an extremely dense and
strong material. One needs to know just how to dry it and then how to
mill and plane it - and then re-plane it! As well, there are
applications where it simply won't work (I have personal experience
with one such application, where I was the first person to recommend
the material to the user, then they ended up buying if from a supplier
and using it in an area I didn't know about, in a very thin profile,
with only one screw holding the four-foot-ling pieces down on each end
- not the right place for, or at least the way to fasten, this
material).</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I have seen this material in place and
performing extremely well in numerous situations. One just needs to
know how to deal with it.</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>If anyone on this list would like to try
black locust for any of the above applications, please contact
me.</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>tim keating</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
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</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><tt>--</tt></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
<br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
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