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Dear Mr. Vaduro: If it's cost effective to install solar water heating systems, it would be cost effective to install DHR systems as shown in RRMI's Tables @ http://gfxtechnology.com/RMI-HE-5.pdf.<br>Carmine<br><br><div><div id="SkyDrivePlaceholder"></div><hr id="stopSpelling">From: rob.vadurro@state.nm.us<br>To: greenbuilding@lists.bioenergylists.org<br>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 14:28:36 +0000<br>Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] new solar heating system in this country<br><br>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">We use a drainback system in our parks because our parks are largely seasonal in use, meaning, there are vast amounts of time when the system would be collecting
heat and little or no use, resulting in big problems. Also, in this part of the country, we have power outages, which can also lead to big trouble. The drainback system solves these issues passively and integrally. If you don’t have these problems (I would
think most applications would to some extent) then the closed loop glycol system would probably be better.</span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: ARchitxt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Rob Vadurro AIA, LEED AP</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: ARchitxt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Park Architect</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: ARchitxt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">New Mexico State Parks</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: ARchitxt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">P.O. Box 1147</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: ARchitxt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Santa Fe, NM 87505</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: ARchitxt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">505-476-3383</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: ARchitxt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">505-476-3361 (fax)</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";"> greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org [mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Nick Pyner<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, March 14, 2012 6:44 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Green Building<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Greenbuilding] new solar heating system in this country</span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">Not to me.
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">I don't know anything about drain back systems but my understanding is that:</span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">1. If you use a closed loop glycol collector, you don't need drain back</span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">2, If you just use water, you drain the water and refill it the next morning - with water , which I guess goes quite soem way to explain why people use glycol.</span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">In the article alluded to</span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">1. They don't seem to draw any distinction between open and closed loop systems.
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">2. they glibly talk about an oversized heat exchanger. This may be detrimental to the heat exchanger performing its prime function - namely, exchanging heat.</span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">3. It seems that they must have air in the circlation system. This would be fatal to collector efficiency</span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">4. The actual collector must be the worst design ever. I have never actually seen a serpentine design like that in actual production. The only place where you would
see anything like that is in an article showing how not to do it. </span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;"> Even if there is no need to distinguish between open and close loop systems, and the heat exchanger is OK, and they have some secret air relief device, who on earth
would take Wagner Solar seriously, when they have a collector like that? </span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">I don't know who the smiling guys are at the top of the page, but they could certainly do with asking some questions. Maybe they are just salesmen quoting a press
handout. </span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">And another thing. Why would you use a second heat exchanger system for backup? Surely it is simpler to just install an electric element at the bottom of the tank
like everybody else does? </span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 10pt;">Nick Pyner<br>
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Dee Why NSW </span><BR>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";">-----Original Message-----<br>
<b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a> [<a href="mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>]<b>On
Behalf Of </b>Sacie Lambertson<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, 14 March 2012 7:06 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Greenbuilding<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Greenbuilding] new solar heating system in this country</span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style="font-family: "Verdana","sans-serif";">This sounds very good to me:<br>
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<a href="http://www.buildinggreen.com/live/index.cfm/2012/3/13/German-Innovation-in-Solar-Water-Heating" target="_blank">http://www.buildinggreen.com/live/index.cfm/2012/3/13/German-Innovation-in-Solar-Water-Heating</a></span></p>
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