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<DIV>I do not understand your paragraph, Peter Kidd. Can you please clarify? I
understand your comment about new world of compact insulation solutions—you’re
saying different layers wouldn’t lessen thermal mass as if they did, all
insulation would be layers of differing materials, I believe—but I still haven’t
found an answer to my question about the modified acrylic latex resin in the
overlay product.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Re thermal mass, every book and article I’ve read identifies good thermal
mass materials being clay, concrete, water, stone—and that’s pretty much it
(ceramic tile being clay, adobe being clay, etc.) If you don’t like the earth
materials definition, what is the definition of high thermal mass materials? How
are they defined scientifically, chemically, mathematically, or in whatever way,
but a very exact, precise way? I need technical details on this.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>No, I am not at all wondering if adding a second layer may cause problems.
I am quite sure. But I have to have hard factual data to present to the other
side to get them to pay for a total redo of the floor.</DIV>
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<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=peterkidd@shaw.ca
href="mailto:peterkidd@shaw.ca">Peter Kidd</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 13, 2013 7:35 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=greenbuilding@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:greenbuilding@lists.bioenergylists.org">greenbuilding@lists.bioenergylists.org</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Greenbuilding] Passive solar home--concrete overlay re
thermal mass</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: small; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none; DISPLAY: inline">Between
different materials! Is it anyone's experience that simply layering materials
achieves significant resistance to heat loss? (that's not the same as "wear
layers") If that works we have a new world of compact insulation solutions ahead
of us. The followup comment about tile or other "overlays" versus an intimately
bonded new layer was about there being no air gap or other materials to add a
little resistance in the latter case. And earth vs non-earth, that is a
philosophical choice not an issue of "thermal mass". Am I correctly recalling
that the original "slab" was two inches as well? It is seriously cracked, and
you are wondering if adding a second relatively thin, apparently (also?)
un-reinforced layer may cause problems. What is under the current concrete
layer?<BR><BR><BR>
<DIV class=moz-cite-prefix>On 13-05-13 10:06 AM, Vadurro, Rob, EMNRD
wrote:<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=mid:C2065F2B7F939F45838077998D9E842C1149E7C9@CEXMB003.nmes.lcl
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<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">I
believe the concern is the transfer of heat between different materials. I
can’t remember where I saw it, but there was a table showing the transferring
heat between base and finish materials, say tile to concrete slab below in
passive solar conditions and the rate of transfer was much less than one might
think. The joint between the two impeded the heat transfer, in other words. I
would think an acrylic additive may impede the transfer even more. The best is
always to not cover the slab, only color it, if heat retention in the slab is
the goal.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"><o:p></o:p></SPAN> </P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Rob
Vadurro, AIA<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Park
Architect<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">New
Mexico State Parks<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">1220
South Saint Francis Drive<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">Santa
Fe, NM 87505<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">505-476-3383<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d">505-476-3361
fax</SPAN><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Baskerville Old
face','serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d"><o:p></o:p></SPAN> </P>
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<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">
Greenbuilding [<A class=moz-txt-link-freetext
href="mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</A>]
<B>On Behalf Of </B>Topher<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 13, 2013 8:39
AM<BR><B>To:</B> Green Building<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Greenbuilding] Passive
solar home--concrete overlay re thermal mass<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p></o:p> </P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal>On 5/13/2013 1:07 AM, KTOT (g) wrote:<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt; MARGIN-TOP: 5pt">
<P class=MsoNormal>Does anyone have experience or knowledge about this?
Using or not using a concrete overlay product for the top layer of a floor
for thermal mass, vs. a plain darkly stained concrete slab
<o:p></o:p></P></BLOCKQUOTE>
<P class=MsoNormal><BR>A concrete overlay product is likely to be roughly
similar in thermal characteristics to a concrete slab. Meaning that you
will just have a thicker thermal mass. It seems unlikely that you should
be worried about <I>too much</I> thermal mass in a passive solar house.
The overlay product might have a lower specific heat, or conductivity, wither
of which will reduce it's effectiveness somewhat. Remember to stick with
a dark color.<BR><BR>Thank You Kindly,<BR><BR>Corwyn<BR><BR><o:p></o:p></P><PRE>-- <o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Topher Belknap<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Green Fret Consulting<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Kermit didn't know the half of it...<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE><A href="http://www.GreenFret.com/" moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.GreenFret.com/</A><o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE><A href="mailto:topher@greenfret.com" moz-do-not-send="true">topher@greenfret.com</A><o:p></o:p></PRE></DIV><BR>
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