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    <p><font face="Arial">Wow, thank you for the detail!</font></p>
    <p>I will have to raise the house up 24-30" in order to be on grade
      with the septic at the south side. The other 3 sides will have
      some variant of a retaining wall or slope.  I have concerns about
      the Legalitt from that perspective as well. That and the level of
      insulation--I've traditionally done R34 under the slab. They do
      have a water system option, but I've not yet found the pipe
      diameter specs on the website for it.<br>
    </p>
    <p>I've always thought concrete to be a better transfer medium for
      radiant heat. Do you notice a difference with your floor system?</p>
    <p>Lynelle<br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2017-07-16 10:58 PM, John Salmen
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
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        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Interesting.
            If a slab is to be used I am a fan of frost protected
            foundations or integrated footing in a cold climate. A lot
            less ground invasive and a lot less concrete. Not so
            effective here on the west coast as we don’t need much
            depth.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Now
            ‘if a slab is to be used’ in a consistently cold place
            heating the slab makes sense if there is sufficient
            insulation below. The use of air has  a very ancient history
            – as does water. Air though only contains a tiny fraction of
            the energy storage potential of water. They will both
            transfer heat but what it means practically is that air will
            transfer heat quickly and water will transfer it more
            slowly. From here on it it gets more complicated looking at
            pumps and fans to figure out who is working more efficiently
            but strong suspicion would be that water flow would be
            drawing less energy (heated to a lower temperature, slow
            pumping velocity)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">What
            is generally more important to me environmentally is both
            minimizing materials and being a bit qualitative about what
            the material is for the job it needs to do. We currently
            waste a lot of materials on buildings. What seems like a
            good idea is often bad design.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Look
            at the pictures on the lego slab site. A structural slab can
            be as thin as 3” and work well if reinforced properly. The
            buildup they have with what looks like 2-3” pvc pipe (or in
            another picture galvanized duct would probably require 6-8”
            of concrete. That is a lot of energy intensive material to
            no structural effect (simply contains pipe). Someone could
            try to make an argument about ‘mass’ but typically a well
            insulated drywalled house with a few tile floors has more
            than enough ‘mass’. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Also
            a radiant water slab is typically ½” polyethylene pipe
            classed as either a type 1 or 2 plastic – a bit better on
            the scale than PVC which is a type 3 and has long been
            recognized as not the greatest – in comparison.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">The
            most important element is insulation and they are using
            plastifab brand type 1 expanded polystyrene. About 98.8
            percent air and 1.1 percent of some vinyl monomer (PVC) –
            expanded with pentane. I don’t have issues with that so much
            as it is effective for the job it is doing and can go having
            some life as it is a solid isolatable and recyclable
            material (for some uses). Its wholesale cost is generally
            abound 16 cents a board foot and retails for about 3 times
            that. There are better foams and monomers out there but
            guess what PVC is cheap – so industry uses it. What can we
            do but be efficient with what industry gives us thankful
            people.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">I
            italicized ‘if you use a slab’ as I’ve eliminated concrete
            slabs in projects as only a footing is required for load
            bearing elements and have used the foam as the floor system
            with ply sheathing laminated over the foam supporting
            interior walls and finished floors. Radiant heating tubes
            are imbedded in the foam. An FPS footing can be done without
            an integrated slab. Check with your engineer. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Thanks
            for the opportunity to comment on that.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Best<br>
            John<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext"
                  lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext"
                lang="EN-US"> Greenbuilding
                [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">mailto:greenbuilding-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>]
                <b>On Behalf Of </b>Lynelle Hamilton<br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Sunday, July 16, 2017 6:23 PM<br>
                <b>To:</b> Green Building<br>
                <b>Subject:</b> [Greenbuilding] Anyone know about the
                Legalett Slab System<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Gill Sans
            MT","sans-serif"">Has anyone had any
            experience with this?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Gill Sans
            MT","sans-serif"">Many thanks!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Gill Sans
            MT","sans-serif"">Lynelle</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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