[Stoves] WorldStove replies to BioFuelWatyche's latest imprecise reporting of facts

Tue Jul 26 10:58:14 CDT 2011

Dear Kevin

There are already several pots on the market that generate electricity using
a TEG in base. This is undoubtedly the future. That are all sorts of
applications like that. The upper operating temperature is governed by the
solder used to attach the elements on the system so it is a no-brainer that
different materials will give is much higher operating temps.

The one I like best has a USB port on the handle so you can plug in any USB
device like a phone USB cable. Electronics can be hidden in the handle
giving reliable voltage control. In these cases, it is best if the TEG is
not very efficient. It would not be good for example to have a 50% efficient
system between the heat source and the contents of the pot. Better to remain
below 10%. They are about 3% now, with the low Delta T ones about 1%. OK,
that could be improved, but we don't want to increase the fuel consumption
noticeably, let alone dramatically.

Regards
Crispin
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/38627

Dear Crispin

I think you might be onto a very important concept in your last paragraph,
where you propose "integrated energy systems." All energy systems have their
own special advantages and disadvantages. By combining systems, as you
suggest, it may be possible to build on their individual advantages, and
avoid their disadvantages.

Specifically, for example, TEG's are very inefficient, and they make little
to no sense as "stand alone generation systems", but in the case where they
are tied into a stove system, where the "reject heat" from the TEG's will be
fully used for cooking or space heating, then the TEG power has no operating
fuel cost. Now, if such a TEG system was integrated with a battery system,
in a way to prevent excessive drawdown of the batteries, extended battery
life could contribute favourably to overall system economics.

There is potentially a very interesting "integrated energy system" lurking
here: As one simple example, Solar and wind during the day, TEG in the
evening and night, with a battery system to level things out. There would be
many "variations on the basic theme", depending on the site specific
circumstances... a system that was relevant to Mongolia, would likely be
very different from a system that was relevant and optimal for Kenya.

Best wishes,

Kevin

----- Original Message -----
From: "Crispin Pemberton-Pigott" <crispinpigott at gmail.com>
To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'" 
<stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2011 12:14 AM
Subject: Re: [Stoves] WorldStove replies to BioFuelWatyche's latestimprecise
reporting of facts

> Dear Xavier
>
> Your story of issuing warnings from the Land of Reality was 
> interesting, if also depressingly familiar.
>
> With regard to SHS, it seems the South Africans are proving what 
> people wanted to know - does it bring some relief from rural poverty.
>
> As (then called) GTZ showed over a number of years (more than 5 I 
> think, perhaps 7) solar cookers are not, on their own, viable 
> commercially. The caveat for that claim is that low power, low 
> temperature cookers
> (steamers?)
> have made a go of it - I am thinking of the folding aluminized plastic 
> sheets. But in terms of 1.4 m diameter 'ordinary' concentrating solar 
> cooking, any promotion of them requires the addition of an efficient, 
> rapid starting wood stove to go with them.
>
> So, when it comes to SHS, why not add thermoelectric power generation 
> to the family stove? It could be incorporated into the SHS system to 
> provide additional power and to save draining (cycling) the battery so 
> much. This would lead to a longer working lifetime. Neither the panel 
> nor the battery nor the stove would have to be large enough to provide 
> all power needed at once. The cost of adding a TEG to the system might 
> be much less than replacing batteries early, adding panels or 
> upgrading the controller.
>
> Regards
> Crispin
>
>
>
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