[Stoves] Designing for the affluent AND the poor.... this is NOT Re: ocean acidification

[Paul Anderson]

Thank you Richard and Andrew,

I agree with your comments below EXCEPT that you did not change the 
Subject line.   And therefore List readers who are fed up with the 
oceanic acidity discussion are unlikely to have read your comments.  By 
the way, I did NOT read those messages.   But I do read whatever Andrew 
and Richard contribute to the Listserv.

Now, about designs for the affluent AND the poor.   This relates to 
"trickle down technology" that believes that by helping the rich, the 
poor will benefit.....  EVENTUALLY benefit.   Sure.   a few years or 
decades or lifetimes later.

I am glad that affluent societies financially supported cell/mobile 
phone development.  A great example of trickle down technology coming 
rather quickly.   But it reached the poor societies because business 
found that it could make money off of the needs of poor people to also 
communicate.   And microchips etc are really inexpensive.   We are 
unlikely to see similar benefits relating to cookstoves.

Even as it is today, MUCH of stove work/efforts are targeted to the more 
affluent of the poor, those who are in the upper parts of the BASE of 
the pyramid (BOP).   That makes more sense than trying to get biomass 
fuel stoves into typical American and European households.   But that 
approach (well established and supported by the GACC and the World Bank 
ACESS programs) still leaves a massive lack of attention to the needs of 
the true base of the BOP.   But at least the distance to trickle down 
from the upper BOP to the lower BOP is less (and should be faster) than 
trickle down from the Top of the Pyramid to be base of the BOP.

If you decide to reply to this Thread of messages, please stick to this 
topic.   (Or change the Subject line to reflect what you are actually 
talking about.   After all, the Subject line has at least two 
purposes:   One is to continue the Thread, and the other is to inform 
the reader what is the actual subject being discussed.)

Paul      with 4 more days in Uganda, then I bring home over 300 pounds 
of stove progress (available baggage allowance for 3 people) to show at 
Stove Camps and biochar meetings in late July, early Sept and mid 
October in Oregon, Tennessee, and Massachusetts, respectively.   I hope 
to see many of you as I cross the USA by car from my home base in Illinois.




Paul S. Anderson, PhD  aka "Dr TLUD"
Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu   Skype: paultlud  Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website:  www.drtlud.com

On 7/5/2013 7:01 PM, Richard Stanley wrote:
> Hi Andrew.
>
> Climate "discussions" aside,   I wanted to elaborate on the implications of your observation about where" designing" is easier:
>   I agree with you that it is easier to design anything "for someone" ( especially those less equipped to express their opinions and experiences, needs and resources)…... than to do it with them in their context…
>
> My own experience tells me that the latter is the sticky part that few really want to get into and it's a huge part of determining whether or
> not ones best intentions stick or not. That sticky part makes really designing from within a good bit more challenging that simply designing a technical object and selling it here….
>
> Richard Stanley
> NW part of the Americas
> ==================
> On Jul 4, 2013, at 12:14 AM, ajheggie at gmail.com wrote:
>
> [Default] On Thu, 4 Jul 2013 05:41:33 +0700,Paul Olivier
> <paul.olivier at esrla.com> wrote:
>
>> It is easy to design stoves for poor people in Third World countries. It is
>> a much bigger challenge to design them for use each day in our own kitchens.
> Stove design and use is on topic for [stoves] but there are other
> forums on which it is better to discuss world changing effects,
> important as they might be.
>
> AJH
>
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