[Stoves] TLUD and biochar production

Tue May 7 12:47:51 CDT 2013

Dear Ray, Ron, Josh  and all,

During composting the process happens so fast by the time the carbon has stabilized there are still pockets of toxins (un-ionized ammonia, anaerobic and organic acids) left in the compost. Therefore the compost is sent to curing where ammonia converts to nitrates and aerobic pockets undergo aerobic conditions. I think this Curing step would work well for newly processed biochar.  Mixing with compost is an excellent way to do this. Or, like with un-cured compost, add to the soil and wait before planting. 

I am sorry I brought up the subject at this time as there is so much going on. Perhaps we can come back to this later?

Thanks

Frank

Thanks 

Frank Shields

BioChar Division
Control Laboratories, Inc. 
42 Hangar Way
Watsonville, CE  95076

(831) 724-5422 tel
(81) 724-3188 fax
frank at biocharlab.com
www.controllabs.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Ray Menke [mailto:ray.menke at gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2013 5:58 AM
To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
Cc: Frank Shields; Josh Kearns
Subject: Re: [Stoves] TLUD and biochar production

I have to agree with Josh and Ron, and wonder which TLUD stove Frank is using for cooking meals.  At the end of a cooking session, the charcoal in the bottom of my stoves is glowing brilliant red with small purple flames.  If I extinguish the char in a bucket of water, there are very few floating pieces of charcoal (these are easily skimmed off and dried separately for future use in another cooking session).  During a week's time, the remaining charcoal is washed and screened over a compost pile, and then dried in the sun.  This is high quality charcoal, and can be used to run a generator, log splitter, or other 4 cycle engine.  For the last two years, I have been screening charcoal with 1/4" mesh screen, and adding these screenings to compost piles that I turn with the front end loader of a diesel tractor.  This year, I have begun a two part screening process for the char.  The material that falls through the 1/4" screen is retained, and subject to another screening with 1/8" hardware cloth screen.  The result are pieces of charcoal less than 1/4" and greater than 1/8".  When mixed into the compost, it makes a fantastic potting soil, and our garden has never been as beautiful as it is today.  My neighbors are begging for compost!  We harvested 3" onions, arugula, spinach, and asparagus yesterday.  The tomatoes are 3" in diameter, but still green.  We are using no commercial fertilizer.  My neighbor is buying bags of Miracle Grow fertilizer, but our garden is out performing her garden.  I should add that I cannot get enough of this stuff, and have collected dead trees and limbs to process 120 fifty-five gallons of biomass into charcoal.  (I keep a record of each burn.)  If you watch Josh's video, you will see that he is processing limbs of wood all cut to a uniform size, and even some of the larger diameter pieces break easily, and have no trace of raw wood in the center.  On the other hand, I have been processing some wood from dry creek-beds that is too dirty to saw.  I throw six inch dead logs into the barrel, surrounded by smaller wood, but packed solid.  When the bottom holes "illuminate", I close off all air, and a day to two later, dump out the contents of the barrel.  The larger logs are called "brands", and I carefully pick them out for the next barrel (after another run, they are turned into walnut sized pieces of charcoal).  This total operation creates no smoke, similar to what Josh is showing for uniform sizes of wood.  If logs are present, there is a bit of smoke when the barrel is being sealed.  The end result needs careful inspection and screening because the charcoal is often not a good as the charcoal made in the TLUD stoves.  Rejected charcoal can, and is, finished (as fuel) in a cooking or water heating stove.  Large brands go into the top of the next 55 gal drum to be processed into charcoal.

On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 8:41 PM,  <rongretlarson at comcast.net> wrote:
> Frank, Josh,  and list - see below
>
>    Most of this was written before lunch and so only a bit of response below
> to Josh,  who also answered Frank.   Not exactly relevant, but I went down
> to the Colorado House (Ag committee)  to support SB 13-273, which puts 
> a little bit more state emphasis on removing beetle kill. (Minimize 
> fire
> hazard)  Passed the second chamber committee with only 1 "Nay" vote, 
> so is sure of getting through the remainder.  The only reason for 
> going was to get the word "biochar" on the table.  The Committee chair 
> (Fischer - who knows
> biochar) helped by asking a question.
>
> More below, trying not to duplicate Josh
>
> ________________________________
> From: "Frank Shields" <frank at compostlab.com>
> To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" 
> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Sent: Monday, May 6, 2013 10:52:13 AM
> Subject: [Stoves] TLUD and biochar production
>
>
> Dear Stovers,
>
> It seems that a TLUD would make poor quality biochar.
>     [RWL1:  This is a strong statement that requires more proof than 
> you are giving.  My contrary belief (based on what  I read about 
> improved ag production from char made in TLUDs) is that  such char is 
> very good.  The reason is that such char is often measured to be 
> around 600 C - near the supposed sweet spot.
>
>
> There are only two hot
> spots. One is the flame front and the second the flame heating the pot.
>     [RWL2:   The most important hot spot is a third one - at the (moving)
> pyrolysis front.]
>
>
> As
> the flame front migrates down through new biomass volatiles come off 
> and hit cooler conditions above in the left over char where I would 
> think condensation of organics would occur.
>     [RWL3:  You should be using the term "pyrolysis front".  The only 
> "flame" ever traveling through the char is after the pyrolysis front 
> reaches the bottom of the fuel bed (and that is when to stop).  The 
> "cooler" char above the pyrolyss front is still very hot and not much condensation is
> occurring  - as I understand it.   In fact there may be more cracking in
> this hot char area.  Very little CO2 gets through  (which is ideal, as 
> we want the CO that comes about because the char is hot enough).
>
>       Josh Kearns has an earler response note on this, which I 
> endorse.  But it would be ideal to have someone report in detail.  
> Plots I have seen of char temperature are quite constant over time, 
> once the pyrolysis front has passed.  There are always tars left, but 
> as Josh sad, those are useful.  The char-making stove char hasn't received any bad press that I am aware of.
> There is a lot of good press.
>
> This is good as a cleaner gas goes up
> to the secondary air to combust and heat the pot. But the char is left 
> with tars. This could be better for used as charcoal for other cooking 
> but would make very poor biochar for the garden - if this is what happens.
>
>      [RWL4:  So my "If" response is that "this is NOT what happens".  Anyone
> have contradictory evidence?    Ron]
>
>
> Regards
>
> Frank
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Frank Shields
>
> BioChar Division
> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> 42 Hangar Way
> Watsonville, CE  95076
>
> (831) 724-5422 tel
> (81) 724-3188 fax
> frank at biocharlab.com
> www.controllabs.com
>
>
>
>
>
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--
Ray  Menke