[Stoves] Torrified Pellets

Ronald Hongsermeier rwhongser at web.de
Sun May 24 12:13:20 MDT 2015


Hi again, Dean!

Spent most of the afternoon chasing down infos on torrefaction projects. 
So far I know of two running for sure, maybe a third, the last in SC, 
the former two in PA and SD. The one in Rapid City SD is a production 
plant (which is similar to one in the Netherlands.) tsi-inc.net is their 
website, but the browser keeps timing out, so don't know if they're down 
for Sunday, or what.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biWNh1iPnzQ

the one in PA runs about 1000# of biocoal / hour
http://www.terragreenenergy.com/

The Greenville, SC plant should be in production at 11K t/annum
http://www.integrofuels.com/

If I understand you, your goal in this is to try to get an idiot-proof fuel?

regards,
Ronald von Bayernnässetrotzbayernchampions




On 24.05.2015 19:52, Dean Still wrote:
> Dear Ronald,
>
> Thanks for your helpful comments. Charcoal without remaining wood in 
> it doesn't make smoke but, of course, wood really likes to smoke. With 
> biomass the preparation including recipe, drying, pellet size, etc. 
> makes a big difference in emissions when trying to get down to the 
> very low levels needed to protect health. I'm making some torrified 
> pellets and will report back after testing under the hood.
>
> All Best,
>
> Dean
>
> On Sat, May 23, 2015 at 3:52 PM, Ronald Hongsermeier <rwhongser at web.de 
> <mailto:rwhongser at web.de>> wrote:
>
>     Dear Dean,
>     I may seem like I'm harping here, but now that you've said a bit
>     more, you've mentioned a couple of factors that I have noticed in
>     my limited experience without a hood and therefore without
>     concrete parametric analysis, but for which I can give some
>     postulates.
>
>     1. The wood-gas stove in design mode depends on a uniform fuel
>     "chunk-size" which promotes a level "pyrolysis" front(planar)
>     migrating towards the bottom of the stove. If that plane is broken
>     by dis-uniformity in the fuel or overly large gaps between the
>     fuel pieces, you will get a spot drop in temperature along with
>     glowing fuel which will migrate unevenly towards the bottom of the
>     stove, breaking the pyrolysis front and sometimes dropping the
>     mean temp inside the burning chamber such that the rising wood gas
>     will no longer be close enough to critical temp that the onset of
>     2nd-ary air will ignite it.
>
>     2. 1. would be consistent with the bark observation. Bark
>     generally has lots more minerals and less energy per unit mass.
>     Did you/they assure dryness level of the bark? Were the pieces
>     between (cross-section/10-20) of the stoves throat? Do you mean
>     pellets from eucalyptus wood or when eucalyptus oil is poured on
>     the fuel? Off the shelf kerosin burners here in germany are
>     strictly regulated as to what you may or may not burn in them. If
>     it is smoking it is either wrong fuel, design flaw or user error.
>
>     3. Pellets pack closely, so if they are smoking, usually the
>     problem can be fixed by either turning up the fan a bit or putting
>     some chimney length between the secondary air and the pan to
>     increase the draw. (i.e., the primary air is probably not of
>     sufficient pressure to deliver enough O2 to the pyrolysis front to
>     keep it hot enough such that it will ignite upon contact with the
>     secondary air.)
>
>     4. Because torrefied pellets are partially reacted, they may be
>     somewhat less dense and especially because the ends will be
>     cleaner, they may not resist airflow as much, which may help
>     somewhat with 3. above. I would expect them to act very similar to
>     dry pellets, except for the difference in density.
>
>     regards,
>     Ronald von Aftermidnighttimeforantibiotics (and bed)
>
>
>
>
>     On 23.05.2015 23:49, Dean Still wrote:
>>     Dear Ron,
>>
>>     We had three women interns here at the research center for a
>>     summer who found cleaner burning recipes for the TLUDs gathered
>>     from the surrounding forest. Some things like bark make smoke, etc.
>>
>>     Many pellets smoke when using eucalyptus, etc. Different mixtures
>>     of kerosene make more or less smoke in off the shelf stoves.
>>
>>     I'm wondering if torrified pellets will burn cleaner than normal
>>     pellets.
>>
>>
>>     Best,
>>
>>     Dean
>>
>>     On Sat, May 23, 2015 at 1:28 PM, Ronald Hongsermeier
>>     <rwhongser at web.de <mailto:rwhongser at web.de>> wrote:
>>
>>         Hi Dean,
>>         I remember that there was a proposed university program (W.
>>         Virginia or the Carolinas??) In view of the deaths(not _many_
>>         but tragic) that have taken place due to off-loading of
>>         pellets at some European ports (CO in the hold) The
>>         torrefaction could lead to a more inert fuel. That's hopeful
>>         speculation on my part however. You would be transporting
>>         some less bound water and the energy density is better than
>>         regular pellets in addition to the lack of liquid or vapor
>>         H2O absorption issue mentioned before-- these would lend
>>         efficiencies in the logistics end of things and an even more
>>         uniform fuel than regular pellets, which tend to absorb quite
>>         a  bit of water here in the damp winter weather...
>>         I have to admit that I'm a bit puzzled as to what you mean by
>>         cleaner fuel recipes. What specific pollutant are you
>>         interested in or are you talking about particulate?
>>         If you aren't choking the burn by putting the pot too close,
>>         you should be getting a very clean burn with a TLUD?!?
>>
>>         regards,
>>         Ron
>>
>>         On 23.05.2015 22:01, Dean Still wrote:
>>>         Hi Ronald,
>>>
>>>         I'll keep looking. I think that we shouldn't forget cleaner
>>>         fuel recipes as part of the solution.
>>>
>>>         Best,
>>>
>>>         Dean
>>>
>>>         On Sat, May 23, 2015 at 12:33 PM, Ronald Hongsermeier
>>>         <rwhongser at web.de <mailto:rwhongser at web.de>> wrote:
>>>
>>>             Hi Dean,
>>>             I did some searching around on the internet several
>>>             years ago on this topic.
>>>             I'd like to try torrefied stuff as well, but I struck
>>>             out at that time.
>>>             No idea where to find them.
>>>             The main advantage that I picked up on at that time was
>>>             that they should be relatively inert as to picking up
>>>             extra water after they were pelletized.
>>>             Cleaner burning than what?
>>>             clean burning is a control issue, not a fuel issue as
>>>             far as I understand. If I understand the concept
>>>             correctly, it's like using part of the large molecules
>>>             initially broken out (cracked) by the heat in the
>>>             reaction vessel to coat the surfaces of the remaining
>>>             unpyrolized material. This should burn quite okay in a TLUD.
>>>
>>>             regards,
>>>             Ronald von Nasennebenhöhlenhölle (but I'm coming back)
>>>
>>>
>>>             On 23.05.2015 20:56, Dean Still wrote:
>>>>             Hi All,
>>>>
>>>>             I'd like to try torrified pellets in a TLUD under the
>>>>             emissions hood.
>>>>
>>>>             Any ideas on where to find them?
>>>>
>>>>             Or if it should be cleaner burning?
>>>>
>>>>             Best,
>>>>
>>>>             Dean
>>>>
>>>>
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