[Stoves] Premixing

[Muhammad Nurhuda]

Prof. Paul Anderson and all,

In Prime/UB stoves, the smoke is burnt partially using residual pre-heated
primary air. That mechanism could crack large molecules, such that when the
they are burnt the flame becomes much transparent that if they are directly
burnt without initial combustion.
The direction of secondary air is made cross and against the direction of
smoke by geometrical shape of the burning chamber.

Kind regards
M. Nurhuda

On Sat, Oct 8, 2016 at 6:45 PM, Paul Anderson <psanders at ilstu.edu> wrote:

> Dear Prof. Nurhuda,
>
> Please clarify about what happens in the Prime/UB stoves.  A diagram
> showing air flows would be useful.
>
> I suspect that the "direction of the secondary air against the smoke"
> would be increasing turbulence (mixing) and not PRE-mixing of air (with O2)
> and combustible gases in some way that is separate in (very short)  time
> and space from what Alex is doing.
>
> Regardless of premixing or not, readers of this Stoves Listserv would be
> interested in any updates about the activities of Prime/UB stoves, which I
> believe is having strong sales in Indonesia (and beyond?).  Your good work
> deserves to be known and acknowledged.
>
> Paul
>
> Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
> Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu
> Skype:   paultlud    Phone: +1-309-452-7072
> Website:  www.drtlud.com
>
> On 10/7/2016 11:14 PM, Muhammad Nurhuda wrote:
>
> Dear all,
>
> The Prime/UB stoves utilizes the pre-mixing mechanisms by altering the
> direction of secondary air against the smoke, in addition to the
> pre-heating of both primary and secondary air.
>
> On Oct 8, 2016 11:11 AM, "Paul Anderson" <psanders at ilstu.edu> wrote:
>
>> Alex and all,
>>
>> This work on pre-mixing is, in my opinion, extremely important.  Many
>> should participate.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
>> Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu
>> Skype:   paultlud    Phone: +1-309-452-7072
>> Website:  www.drtlud.com
>>
>> On 10/7/2016 6:15 AM, alex english wrote:
>>
>> Paul,
>> You asked what I might be able to do to shed light on the conditions for
>> achieving a blue flame.
>>
>> This week I followed the evidence. It was clear from running a TLUD at
>> higher temperatures that the flame behaved differently than my original
>> example. The flame speed of the mix could attach at the point of secondary
>> air entrance in a 2 inch pipe ( all measures are inside diameter). Reducing
>> this to 1.5 inches moved the flame up to the transition back to 2 inches.
>> The flame speed was two slow for the higher speed in the 1.5 inch pipe.
>> However the 1.5 inch section was six inches long and it was clear that the
>> flame was not very well premixed because of tall orangey tails extending
>> from the lower blueish portion.  So a few increments of changes later  the
>> burner now has 18 inch mixing tube between the secondary air introduction
>> and the point of flame attachment. It steps down from 2 to1.5 to 1.25 and
>> up again to 1.5 to 2 to 2.5 which is the cone that expands to 6 inches.
>>
>> This is the result;
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sjOTHwDsWo
>>
>> *It is quite different than the origional  slow continuous blueming flame
>> flower *
>> *Here again*
>>
>> *https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnV1e60NTss
>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnV1e60NTss> *
>>
>> *There are a differences that are due to the fuel gasses, the temperature
>> of the gasses and perhaps the excess air values. All play a role. *
>> *The much longer mixing tube changes the net draft as well. Also I was
>> unable to light the mix from the secondary air entrance. Had to be lit top-
>> down.*
>>
>> Here is a fun ignition shot. Talk about descending flame fronts:)
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7JepJ1MdWg
>>
>> You tube has a 'gear' icon in the lower right of the screen where you can
>> control the speed of the video replay (without sound). It is informative to
>> watch these at .25 speed. The glowing meteor sparks show up better.
>> Starting and stopping the videos freeze them in there tracks. If one knew
>> the frame speed of the camera you could almost calculate the velocity of
>> the sparks by the length of their paths.
>>
>> Sorry to interrupt the very interesting discussion of charcoal.
>> Alex
>>
>>
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