[Stoves] ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Re: Stoves Digest, Vol 146, Issue 3

Kevin McLean kevin at sun24.org
Tue Oct 11 15:54:46 CDT 2022


I should have added that rice straw burns the same as maize stalks.  When
fresh cut but looking very dry, a pile of straw lit on the side will smoke
profusely and a pile lit on top barely smokes.  But when the straw dried
for a few weeks after being cut, both piles burn with little smoke.  All
piles smoke quite a bit when the flame goes out, which is when I'd like to
see the embers smothered to make biochar.

On Tue, Oct 11, 2022 at 10:39 PM Kevin McLean <kevin at sun24.org> wrote:

> Thanks, Crispin.  I didn't think there was a shortcut.  I have someone in
> Malawi doing this in a much cruder way with rice straw.  It seems that the
> difference in moisture content between standing dry straw and dry straw
> that is cut and allowed to dry further for another week or two may be
> relevant to rice stubble burning in India and elsewhere.
>
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2022 at 10:23 PM Crispin Pemberton-Pigott <
> crispinpigott at outlook.com> wrote:
>
>> Dear Kevin
>>
>> You test the moisture content using a small digital scale, like you get
>> at a "head shop". It will have a capacity of about 400 or 250 grams. It
>> reads to 0.01 g precision.
>>
>> Take some samples of fuel, weigh them and write the number 1, 2, 3 etc on
>> them with a pen and record the individual masses.
>>
>> You can weigh them all at once if you like.
>>
>> Then put them into a warming drawer of an electric over of the oven
>> itself if you can control the temperature down to 105 C.
>>
>> Leave them for a day (no kidding) and weight them again *after they
>> cool. *
>>
>> Hot fuel can influence the scale's reading.  Physics 101.
>>
>> Divide the new dry mass by the original mass and convert to %. That is
>> the dry portion. Subtract that number from 100% and you have the moisture
>> on a Wet Weight Basis. WWB.
>>
>> WWB is the most common form of describing the fuel moisture in the stove
>> world. However if you are reading something from the USA never assume it is
>> WWB. There is penchant for describing the moisture as a percentage of the
>> dry mass which is of course the Dry Weight Basis.
>>
>> So you should always report the moisture as a % and then put WWB
>> afterwards so anyone reading your text knows what you did.
>>
>> 100% - Dry mass % = % moisture content WWB
>>
>> Regards
>> Crispin
>> *From:* kmclean56 at gmail.com
>> *Sent:* October 11, 2022 12:35 PM
>> *To:* stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>> *Reply to:* stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>> *Subject:* [Stoves] ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Re: Stoves Digest, Vol
>> 146, Issue 3
>>
>> You never need to apologize, Norm.
>>
>> I'm leaning toward the bands over the cooking hole.  A band with maize
>> stalks is simpler and seems to be less smoky.  But the big band advantage
>> is the bundles can be swapped out to extend the cooking session
>> indefinitely.
>>
>> It would be awesome if you could test the band and bundle method at
>> Aprovecho.  We have not yet tried to regulate air flow.
>>
>> Moisture content is obviously important.  Please look at this video where
>> we compare the burning of two piles of freshly cut upright maize stalks
>> that were brown and looked dry.  (You may have seen it on the biochar
>> listserv, but it is also relevant here.)  We are demonstrating the
>> difference in smoke when a pile is lit on the side (left pile, the
>> traditional method in Africa) and when lit on top (right pile, the way we
>> train).  The difference in smoke is stunning.  However, when we compared
>> two piles of stalks that were cut two week previous, both piles burned with
>> little smoke.  I attribute this to moisture content.  Brown upright stalks
>> must have a higher moisture content than stalks that were cut and left on
>> the ground for two weeks.
>>
>> Side by Side Burn of Maize Stalks (video):  https://youtu.be/5M4ntJi_JmY
>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2F5M4ntJi_JmY&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143179687%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=t4tlT554CHyo%2Fx77o%2FkwbWj%2BC2TEJUkSZfvaPELxcTg%3D&reserved=0>.
>> Some of the principles of the top down burn of large piles of maize stalks
>> are probably involved in the burning of stalks in bands from the top.
>>
>> How do you test for moisture content?
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 11, 2022 at 7:19 PM Norman Baker <ntbakerphd at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Kevin;
>>>
>>> First, let me apologize for not getting emissions testing done for you
>>> at Aprovecho. Life seems to get in the way sometimes - especially when
>>> you're older and events crop up suddenly.
>>>
>>> The metal band with the stocks upright is probably a better way to make
>>> use of the maize stocks. From watching your videos it is clear this is
>>> functioning as a hybrid between TLUD's and flame caps. Do you make any
>>> attempt to regulate the air from below? When we go to Aprovecho I can
>>> easily make a band and we can do emissions testing on this new arrangement.
>>> I still plan to compare emissions of dried maize stocks versus maize stocks
>>> at ambient relative humidity. I think there will be a difference. I'm also
>>> planning to do this in a metal band versus the "conservation burn" style
>>> you originally worked with. Let me know what you think.
>>>
>>> Norm
>>>
>>> On Tue, Oct 11, 2022 at 10:05 AM <
>>> stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Send Stoves mailing list submissions to
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>
>>>>    1. ***SPAM*** Maize stalks as cooking fuel in bands and bundles
>>>>       (Kevin McLean)
>>>>    2. ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Maize stalks as cooking fuel in
>>>>       bands and bundles (energiesnaturals at gmx.de)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> Message: 1
>>>> Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2022 19:50:55 +0200
>>>> From: Kevin McLean <kevin at sun24.org>
>>>> To: Stoves and Biofuels Network <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
>>>> Subject: [Stoves] ***SPAM*** Maize stalks as cooking fuel in bands and
>>>>         bundles
>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>         <
>>>> CALxcr-v5W0pxsbUd9wciv7aQ5k2CbiBg2Uo1Z2Yj4-5syEnxWA at mail.gmail.com>
>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>
>>>> We've long been trying to find a way to use maize stalks as a cooking
>>>> fuel
>>>> in Africa.  They are challenging because they burn fast and smoky.  We
>>>> may
>>>> have found a way.
>>>>
>>>> Make a bundle of stalks in a metal band and stand up the bundle so the
>>>> stalks are upright.  Then light the top.  The band has a diameter of 20
>>>> cm.  The stalks burn remarkably clean for about 13 minutes, no tending.
>>>> Then a new bundle can be swapped in to continue the cooking.  Below are
>>>> some videos.
>>>>
>>>> My colleague in Uganda thinks that farmers with two growing seasons can
>>>> cook year round with maize stalks and never need to collect firewood
>>>> again
>>>> ... we'll see.
>>>>
>>>> As a bonus, this makes biochar.
>>>>
>>>> [image: Bands with maize stalks.jpeg]
>>>>
>>>> Videos:
>>>> Self help group leaders being trained on stalks in bands
>>>> <
>>>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/10VXniCh8-JFLg6EwFcImsmYbeJAEDu6D/view?usp=sharing
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdrive.google.com%2Ffile%2Fd%2F10VXniCh8-JFLg6EwFcImsmYbeJAEDu6D%2Fview%3Fusp%3Dsharing&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143179687%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=UQ6XFNjnDyCIfmbK%2BeDAx9mNvruvSjjrq7peQfGW4i0%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>> Stalks in band burning
>>>> <
>>>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/16QvwLwqTIQrV3rDuJGX_zqXJBoXZemKu/view?usp=sharing
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdrive.google.com%2Ffile%2Fd%2F16QvwLwqTIQrV3rDuJGX_zqXJBoXZemKu%2Fview%3Fusp%3Dsharing&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143179687%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=gSUOUwb3j%2FSFcAIEVU6jYkKvs4lO8XFPvqKhf8wMTpg%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>> Swapping bands of stalks
>>>> <
>>>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZYqahvxprdjvsRkVav66clPegWoN3Uyc/view?usp=sharing
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdrive.google.com%2Ffile%2Fd%2F1ZYqahvxprdjvsRkVav66clPegWoN3Uyc%2Fview%3Fusp%3Dsharing&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143179687%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=ymuSt6MkQ7gQHgC26e4eJfP5sGQi698mxKiw4Qj%2Fo70%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kevin McLean, President
>>>> Sun24.org
>>>> -------------- next part --------------
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>>>> >
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>>>> Name: Bands with maize stalks.jpeg
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>>>> URL: <
>>>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20221010/913ffbe8/attachment-0001.jpeg
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flists.bioenergylists.org%2Fpipermail%2Fstoves_lists.bioenergylists.org%2Fattachments%2F20221010%2F913ffbe8%2Fattachment-0001.jpeg&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143179687%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=y2EDqnP2q0mejI5XSoANwO%2B7zVA8x%2BdDwO7hEKMdvVY%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> Message: 2
>>>> Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2022 12:07:22 +0000
>>>> From: "energiesnaturals at gmx.de" <energiesnaturals at gmx.de>
>>>> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
>>>>         <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
>>>> Subject: [Stoves] ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Maize stalks as cooking
>>>>         fuel in bands and bundles
>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>         <
>>>> PAXPR03MB7917338104A32472776AB641A9239 at PAXPR03MB7917.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>>>
>>>> @Kevin
>>>>
>>>> Imagine you rise the sleeve higher up and leave some space between it
>>>> and the bundle.
>>>> It should have a "secondary air effect", I guess, and burn even cleaner.
>>>>
>>>> Holen Sie sich Outlook f?r Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Faka.ms%2FAAb9ysg&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143179687%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=2xuVR3f9vTSMuI7%2FeUT8cqUQOGIWTsIrMPn9zrKu0r8%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> From: Stoves <stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org> on behalf of
>>>> Kevin McLean <kevin at sun24.org>
>>>> Sent: Monday, October 10, 2022 7:50:55 PM
>>>> To: Stoves and Biofuels Network <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
>>>> Subject: [Stoves] ***SPAM*** Maize stalks as cooking fuel in bands and
>>>> bundles
>>>>
>>>> We've long been trying to find a way to use maize stalks as a cooking
>>>> fuel in Africa.  They are challenging because they burn fast and smoky.  We
>>>> may have found a way.
>>>>
>>>> Make a bundle of stalks in a metal band and stand up the bundle so the
>>>> stalks are upright.  Then light the top.  The band has a diameter of 20
>>>> cm.  The stalks burn remarkably clean for about 13 minutes, no tending.
>>>> Then a new bundle can be swapped in to continue the cooking.  Below are
>>>> some videos.
>>>>
>>>> My colleague in Uganda thinks that farmers with two growing seasons can
>>>> cook year round with maize stalks and never need to collect firewood again
>>>> ... we'll see.
>>>>
>>>> As a bonus, this makes biochar.
>>>>
>>>> [Bands with maize stalks.jpeg]
>>>>
>>>> Videos:
>>>> Self help group leaders being trained on stalks in bands<
>>>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/10VXniCh8-JFLg6EwFcImsmYbeJAEDu6D/view?usp=sharing
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdrive.google.com%2Ffile%2Fd%2F10VXniCh8-JFLg6EwFcImsmYbeJAEDu6D%2Fview%3Fusp%3Dsharing&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143179687%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=UQ6XFNjnDyCIfmbK%2BeDAx9mNvruvSjjrq7peQfGW4i0%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>> Stalks in band burning<
>>>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/16QvwLwqTIQrV3rDuJGX_zqXJBoXZemKu/view?usp=sharing
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdrive.google.com%2Ffile%2Fd%2F16QvwLwqTIQrV3rDuJGX_zqXJBoXZemKu%2Fview%3Fusp%3Dsharing&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143179687%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=gSUOUwb3j%2FSFcAIEVU6jYkKvs4lO8XFPvqKhf8wMTpg%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>> Swapping bands of stalks<
>>>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZYqahvxprdjvsRkVav66clPegWoN3Uyc/view?usp=sharing
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdrive.google.com%2Ffile%2Fd%2F1ZYqahvxprdjvsRkVav66clPegWoN3Uyc%2Fview%3Fusp%3Dsharing&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143335899%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=mvrmIIl3XB6Gm7ZaJ6ZsNFhj6cmdMKJT9ZsCt1vBT78%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kevin McLean, President
>>>> Sun24.org
>>>>
>>>> [
>>>> https://ci3.googleusercontent.com/mail-sig/AIorK4zAIztZKxS3RzbnyZJ5ZD9359VFc-kCexObS_SF70Gwj0UezW9Scu7SqRnnNXaJ38t35hMmxIs
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fci3.googleusercontent.com%2Fmail-sig%2FAIorK4zAIztZKxS3RzbnyZJ5ZD9359VFc-kCexObS_SF70Gwj0UezW9Scu7SqRnnNXaJ38t35hMmxIs&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143335899%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=xxAPlrrWgWqdDzLWNKpBYK4K5ppPhF4zj4CrHmOn%2FY0%3D&reserved=0>]
>>>>  [
>>>> https://ci3.googleusercontent.com/mail-sig/AIorK4z2tsZ3rgW5tI0WX2NWWXDTqudhoRxP7rN4Fg_TMvvUZ5TZ86uotlupTwH8ivq8hBLlmCLH7Ac
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fci3.googleusercontent.com%2Fmail-sig%2FAIorK4z2tsZ3rgW5tI0WX2NWWXDTqudhoRxP7rN4Fg_TMvvUZ5TZ86uotlupTwH8ivq8hBLlmCLH7Ac&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143335899%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=0laQid23TTFFjiijzmS60j8CzZNlQCFbjIwhAcWuIlY%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> ]
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>>>> >
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>>>> URL: <
>>>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20221011/75c54a51/attachment-0001.jpeg
>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flists.bioenergylists.org%2Fpipermail%2Fstoves_lists.bioenergylists.org%2Fattachments%2F20221011%2F75c54a51%2Fattachment-0001.jpeg&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143335899%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=QiaT7vNBG75tR3Ocz%2Be2CkKDDCcPUtwHht8HdysebQw%3D&reserved=0>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> Subject: Digest Footer
>>>>
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>>>> <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flists.bioenergylists.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fstoves_lists.bioenergylists.org&data=05%7C01%7C%7C8d167d1d3d994cd3dc1308daabb75329%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638011101143335899%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JxiisXPIXvCMl3UyEA5W0Pt3ktSSQ97mAtgmDgFnijI%3D&reserved=0>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our web site:
>>>> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> End of Stoves Digest, Vol 146, Issue 3
>>>> **************************************
>>>>
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