<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)">
<!--[if !mso]>
<style>
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style>
<![endif]--><o:SmartTagType
namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="metricconverter"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="PersonName"/>
<!--[if !mso]>
<style>
st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }
</style>
<![endif]-->
<style>
<!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
span.E-mailStijl17
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:Arial;
color:navy;}
@page Section1
{size:595.3pt 841.9pt;
margin:70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt;}
div.Section1
{page:Section1;}
-->
</style>
</head>
<body lang=NL link=blue vlink=blue>
<div class=Section1>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Paul,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> You start thinking of an analysis
figure in feriliser ! <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Expressed </span></b>in
an <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>old way</span></b> : K2O. Not the real
state !!<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Potasium in general : ash 10-20 % but
comming from 5% ash in the biofuel .You end up with 10%from 5% =0,5 % from the
fuel ,as exemple .<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Fe2O3 stays Fe2O3 but K2Obecomes fast KOH
with H2O from the air! Hygroscopic at room temperature ..<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>K into fuel wil go over KOH to K2CO3 or
stronger SO4—PO4--- Cl- F -SiO3 – salts if those radicals are present
..<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>K transport is not called gasform but
migration as airosol particles .<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>smog alike. Not K2O but KOH or KOH.xH2O
under 400° C<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Now you got the better info for 400-800° C
(My fusion =400 ° C )<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>But mind the KOH at your 170° C is a
flame extigwisher .. Fe2O3 is not ….<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>KOH in the flame explodes and gives your
horizontal flame splitting .<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Suggestion :aspiration of the CO2 off gas
in a fumehood ( by 800° C ) plus water nebulation afterwards wil recuperate
the valuable potasium.and protect your lungs and nose .<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Frans<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>Van:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org
[mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>Namens </span></b>Paul Olivier<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Verzonden:</span></b> zondag 16 oktober 2011
2:17<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Aan:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Discussion
of biomass cooking stoves</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Onderwerp:</span></b> Re: [Stoves] why does
coffee husk biochar smell like urine?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>Frans,<br>
<br>
When subjected to temperatures greater than <st1:metricconverter
ProductID="350 C" w:st="on">350 C</st1:metricconverter>, <br>
are you saying that K2O melts but does not vaporize?<br>
Are you saying that we end up with melted K2O?<br>
If the original coffee husks contains 36% to 38%<br>
then the final biochar must contain at least twice that amount.<br>
If this is correct, then coffee husk biochar must be quite valuable,<br>
not only as a soil amendment but also as a fertilizer.<br>
Surely this cannot be right.<br>
<br>
The coffee husk contains some sort of oily substance<br>
that begins to volatilize at temperatures as low as <st1:metricconverter
ProductID="170 C" w:st="on">170 C</st1:metricconverter>.<br>
When gasified it produces a lot of black soot.<br>
I tried many burner designs in the last few weeks to get rid of the soot and to
turn orange flames into blue.<br>
Supplying hot premixed secondary air does not effectively consume this soot.<br>
Sometimes it makes things worse.<br>
<br>
A few days ago I cheated.<br>
I mixed coffee husks and rice hulls in equal volumes.<br>
(Note that the coffee husk has a bulk density of 180 kg/m3,<br>
while the rice husk has a bulk density of about 100 kg/m3.)<br>
The flame at the base was blue and white.<br>
This is the first time I saw the color white in the gasification of coffee
husks.<br>
As the flame rose, it split into two parts:<br>
one part vertical and the other part more horizontal.<br>
The vertical part was blue/white and the more horizontal part was orange.<br>
But there were no streaks of black within the orange part of the flame and no
visible soot.<br>
<br>
The gasifier that I used looked like this:<br>
<a
href="http://dl.dropbox.com/u/22013094/150%20Gasifier%20Drawings%20PDF/001%20-%20150%20Gasifier%20Assembly.pdf"
target="_blank">http://dl.dropbox.com/u/22013094/150%20Gasifier%20Drawings%20PDF/001%20-%20150%20Gasifier%20Assembly.pdf</a><br>
Note the burner design: <br>
it is a Belonio burner with two rings of burner holes, together with a burner
housing.<br>
This burner design gives by far the best result.<br>
Secondary air is sucked up between the housing and the burner.<br>
It then moves from vertical to horizontal,<br>
and from here it hits the two rings of holes that are offset from one another.<br>
<br>
The best result, of course, is with 100% rice husks.<br>
With the current burner design, the flame is totally blue right from the very
beginning.<br>
<br>
When I mixed rice hulls with coffee husks (half/half by volume),<br>
not only does most of the soot disappear, <br>
but the burn is quite consistent and steady from beginning to end.<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>On Sun, Oct 16, 2011 at 5:35 AM, Frans Peeters <<a
href="mailto:peetersfrans@telenet.be" target="_blank">peetersfrans@telenet.be</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div link=blue vlink=blue>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Dear Paul ,</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> I did many times fusions with pure KOH .</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>At 350° C it melts and is very aggesive to dissolve ceramics Al2O3
and SiC powders . (Diamond recup. )</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>It is verry verry hygroscopic and the hydroxyde airosols with
water in the air gives your nose sense alcalic .</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Your brain makes the link to urine . but not the real potasium make
it .</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>It goes not into gas but sputers airosols has a special creep
effect out of a creuset .! Even after cooling .</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Also a battery and fuel cel with KOH . It creeps in a
isolated conductor for <st1:metricconverter ProductID="20 cm" w:st="on">20 cm</st1:metricconverter>
after years ,and destroys manny apparati .</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>KOH Is colourless but Nickel gives yellow.salts .</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>It does not become K2O2 becouse to destroy SiC we must ad Na2O2 to
oxydize the carbide .</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Potasium is to measure with flame spectro 440 nm purple colour in a
hydrogen flame . (Sodium =yellow . Cupper =green Sr =red</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Sorry ,I drink no coffe !
But have a
friend who drinks pee ….</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Regards</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Frans</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>Christa,<br>
<br>
Do you have any idea why coffee husk biochar smells like urine?<br>
<br>
I just read that coffee husks contain 36% to 38% K2O.<br>
This supposedly accounts for the low melting point of its ash.<br>
That its ash has a low melting point makes sense to me,<br>
since, if I leave the fan on a bit too long after the gasification cycle is
finished,<br>
I see a stony yellowish/white ash at the bottom of the reactor.<br>
<br>
How is this possible that coffee husks could have so much K2O?<br>
What happens to the K2O when it is subjected to heat?<br>
I see that K2O has a melting point > <st1:metricconverter ProductID="350C"
w:st="on">350C</st1:metricconverter>.<br>
If subjected to heat does it turn into K2O2 or even KO2?<br>
At what point does it turn into a gas?<br>
<br>
Does the presence of K2O account for its urine smell?<br>
What does this urine smell mean with regard to the value of coffee husk
biochar?<br>
Would coffee husk biochar be rich in potassium?<br clear=all>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>