<html><head><base href="x-msg://347/"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">David,<br><div>The issue of treating veg oil fhas been of recent concern in our arena, so your interest and the groups discussion insights are very timely. It so happens that we wil be up in the Usambara region of Tanzania ( roughly midway between Kilimanjiro and Dar es salaam) in Lushoto district in a few days and trying amongst other things, to figure out how to best use, used veggie oil in a slow turning thumper like like the single lung 5 to 8 hp Lister …</div><div>We will be using it to supplant the electric motor becasue electricity conneciton is far too expensive for the group. The engine will be used not for electricity generation but as a driver of a small hammer mill which is being used for preparing ag residues for fuel briquettes. It has long been demonstrated that even at the equivlent of 10 cents a Kwh, the addition of the hammer mill element reduces costs of the very labor intensive product, by up to 30%. Of couse electricity has always been more convenient but only of course when you can get it. The group apparently is having a great difficulty getting the lines installed. <div>Will be in touch and feel free to post any thoughts and insights as we go along..</div><div><br></div><div>I wonder btw, if the heat is needed to mix up the caustic. Daytime temps there are rarely below 70deg F/21C. If one could settle with slow cooking at say 110 F/37C, then the insulated solar cooking pot mght be a better option.</div><div><br></div><div>Richard Stanley</div><div><br><div><div>On Nov 7, 2011, at 9:49 PM, David Osborne wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: Verdana; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div class="hmmessage" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma; "><div dir="ltr">Dear Crispin,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>On the long chain to short chain bio fuel, would this change take place if say an individual from a village collected cooking oil and ran it through a jompy boiler once maybe twice with caustic soda at 1%, would this be a good supply of fuel for a community generator? Any one up for a trial? Ps look out for BBC world challenge down to business awards 26th November 2011 on world tv.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>David Osborne<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br><br>> From:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:stoves-request@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves-request@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>> Subject: Stoves Digest, Vol 15, Issue 11<br>> To:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>> Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2011 12:00:01 -0800<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Send Stoves mailing list submissions to<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:stoves-request@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves-request@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> You can reach the person managing the list at<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:stoves-owner@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves-owner@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br>> than "Re: Contents of Stoves digest..."<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Today's Topics:<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> 1. Re: Vegetable oil or biodiesel? (Crispin Pemberton-Pigott)<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Message: 1<br>> Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2011 01:03:57 -0500<br>> From: "Crispin Pemberton-Pigott" <<a href="mailto:crispinpigott@gmail.com">crispinpigott@gmail.com</a>><br>> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"<br>> <<a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>><br>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Vegetable oil or biodiesel?<br>> Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:043801cc9d13$0c08e230$241aa690$@gmail.com">043801cc9d13$0c08e230$241aa690$@gmail.com</a>><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Thanks AD<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> On another list the issue of cold weather and raw oil as a stove fuel came<br>> up and I was thinking that making 'proper biodiesel' might not be necessary,<br>> just heating the oil for a few hours with some caustic soda added. The<br>> purpose is just to break the longer chains down a bit.<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> What is the simplest (meaning rural micro industry) method of turning raw<br>> oil into a decent fuel? I was surprised to find out from the South African<br>> biodiesel association rep that they toss the shorter chains produced during<br>> this process. They did not realise that bioparaffin was little different<br>> from biodiesel. The point is a stove doesn't care what the mixture is. If it<br>> has short chains they simply add to the ease with which it can be turned<br>> into a gas.<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Stove users should not get stuck on definitions of fuel created by the<br>> automobile industry.<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Regards<br>> Crispin<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> +++++++<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Dear Crispin,<br>> I think that those oils which have very high viscocity may have to be<br>> converted into biodiesel. An acquaintance of mine makes biodiesel from<br>> animal tallow, because you cannot fill tallow into the fuel tank of a car.<br>> Yours<br>> A.D.Karve<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> ------------------------------<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> _______________________________________________<br>> Stoves mailing list<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.bioenergylists.org/">http://www.bioenergylists.org/</a><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> End of Stoves Digest, Vol 15, Issue 11<br>> **************************************<br></div>_______________________________________________<br>Stoves mailing list<br><br>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br><a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:<br><a href="http://www.bioenergylists.org/">http://www.bioenergylists.org/</a><br><br></div></span></blockquote></div><br></div></div></body></html>