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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks for this doc. Real useful.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I find it interesting that many analyzers leave out one measurement so to make it easy to always add up to 100%. CO2 is really easy to measure. We are looking for a new CO2 analyzer so I appreciate all the recent info from Crispin and Marc.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Frank <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org [mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Marc Pare<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, September 20, 2012 1:43 AM<br><b>To:</b> Discussion of biomass cooking stoves<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Stoves] Combustion gas analysers<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><blockquote style='margin-left:30.0pt;margin-right:0in'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'>For instructions on how to use the output numbers from a combustion analyser and how to make basic calculations please see the Boiling Point article at <a href="http://www.hedon.info/BP55_SoYouFinallyBoughtACombustionAnalyser?bl=y" target="_blank"><span style='color:#1155CC'>http://www.hedon.info/BP55_SoYouFinallyBoughtACombustionAnalyser?bl=y</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-left:30.0pt;margin-right:0in'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'>which also has a photograph of two different analysers. The formatting is not as easy to read as the original article but it is all there.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Attached is the nice pdf of the aforementioned article. So useful!<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Marc Paré<br>B.S. Mechanical Engineering<br>Georgia Institute of Technology | Université de Technologie de Compiègne<br><br>my cv, etc. | <a href="http://notwandering.com" target="_blank">http://notwandering.com</a><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 9:59 PM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott <<a href="mailto:crispinpigott@gmail.com" target="_blank">crispinpigott@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>Dear Gas Measuring Friends<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>I have been looking at combustion analysers (again) and discovered that my almost favourite portable machine, the TSI CA-6302 is no longer in production. Goodbye to a friend….<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>There is a company Unigas which makes a ragne of machines that have stepped into the same space at a similar price, but with one basic unit that is quite a bit cheaper. So I am forwarding the information in case you are considering evaluating your stove performance. These units are necessary if you want to develop a very low emission stove.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA><a href="http://www.topac.com/e8500gasanalyzer.html" target="_blank">http://www.topac.com/e8500gasanalyzer.html</a> is a top end unit that competes favourably with a Testo 350/454 at about ½ the price. I contacted Topac, just one of many vendors. In Canada one vendor is E&E Process in NW Toronto.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>As there are only about 3 manufacturers of the cells that go into these machines you can expect the cost of adding a cell to be about the same, whoever makes it. A Testo 350 has many features that are not needed for an stove experimenter, but just to let you know, Tom Miles uses one, and so do I when I have a chance! There are two at the SeTAR Centre for field work. But they are seriously expensive.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>From Unigas you can get an 1100 series <a href="http://www.topac.com/gas_flue.html" target="_blank">http://www.topac.com/gas_flue.html</a> which is the basic unit - $1500. It will measure O2 and CO and calculate the CO2, and Excess Air level. That is the lest you need to know to be able to work out what your CO(EF) values are. That means (EA+100%) x CO reading. Also called ‘the undiluted CO level’. The TSI reported this directly but most do not. The usefulness of this figure is that you can make direct comparisons between different stoves or different burns on the same stove to know which is performing better.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>Above the 1100 is a 2200 with an extra cell, and a 4400 with either 3 or 4 more cells. The cost runs up to $4500.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>The 8500 series has, for $10k, an NDIR CO2 cell, NDIR CxHy (hydrocarbons) and electrochemical NO, SO2 and H2S. I have enquired as to whether there is a Hydrogen measurement missing because the CO cell pretty much has to be H2 compensated (being very reactive) but it is not on the brochure as a reported gas. Odd.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>So many cool toys for stovers are emerging. Even the basic units above a printer built in and can stove 600 sets of readings. The expensive ones communicate in real time with a laptop via Bluetooth and there is even a wireless printer. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>Recurrent cost: combustion analysers have running costs. The O2 cells die over time whether or not you use them, and so do the CO cells. But, if you are earning any reasonably amount of money from developing and making stoves, you really need to cover this as part of your ‘professional’ work. It is very difficult to guess how a stove is working or if a small change in it was a help or a hindrance.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>For instructions on how to use the output numbers from a combustion analyser and how to make basic calculations please see the Boiling Point article at <a href="http://www.hedon.info/BP55_SoYouFinallyBoughtACombustionAnalyser?bl=y" target="_blank">http://www.hedon.info/BP55_SoYouFinallyBoughtACombustionAnalyser?bl=y</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>which also has a photograph of two different analysers. The formatting is not as easy to read as the original article but it is all there.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA>Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA style='color:#888888'>Crispin<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span lang=EN-CA style='color:#888888'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>_______________________________________________<br>Stoves mailing list<br><br>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br><a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org" target="_blank">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:<br><a href="http://www.bioenergylists.org/" target="_blank">http://www.bioenergylists.org/</a><br><br><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>