<html>
  <head>
    <meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
      http-equiv="Content-Type">
  </head>
  <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
    Dear Alex, <br>
    <br>
    I haven't carefully read the whole thread but haven't seen
    granularity of fuel addressed. Isn't that what makes a lot of
    difference in the flame/gas quality ( along with the moisture
    content, of course ) and determines the necessity of either using or
    not using forced air? Regarding Dr. Karve's drums I'm wondering how
    careful everyone is in emphasizing fuel moisture and
    particularity/uniformity issues in using these tools.<br>
    <br>
    I think my first sentence above applies to both DD (Imberts or
    others) and TLUD's. <br>
    <br>
    regards,<br>
    Ronald von der Oktoberfestnähe<br>
    <br>
    (mein heutiger Name wird nur dann getragen bei einer
    Bierleichensichtungsrate von > 1 / Tag   ;-)  )<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 29.09.2012 20:55, Alex English
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAH2ub3y+k4ASdz0J0g1zWKFdnXYBMb0FdDo16MHJ2TvV-N4Gyg@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <p>Tom,<br>
        I guess it may depend on what you consider a clean burn. My
        experiments focused the gases through a smaller out let pipe and
        then added the secondary  air. So for a two foot diameter drum
        the pipe was three inches in diameter.   Air was introduced near
        the top having only half that distance to penetrate, and
        combustion occurred in a six inch diameter chimney , six feet
        tall above.</p>
      <p>Combustion was measurably good to very good nineteen times out
        of twenty.</p>
      <p>So, what indeed is the limit?<br>
        Alex</p>
      <div class="gmail_quote">On 2012-09-29 11:47 AM, "Tom Miles" <<a
          moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:tmiles@trmiles.com">tmiles@trmiles.com</a>>
        wrote:<br type="attribution">
        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
          .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
          <div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US">
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">AD,
                  Paul, Kobus and others. Many thanks for the
                  suggestions. </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">What
                  is the largest practical size (kg fuel/hr, kW) for a
                  single TLUD with a clean stack for heat recovery?
                  There must be a limit to the air penetration to get a
                  clean gas burn form a natural draft stack or even a
                  fan driven TLUD. </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Tom
                </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">
                  <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org"
                    target="_blank">stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
                  [mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org"
                    target="_blank">stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>]
                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Anand Karve<br>
                  <b>Sent:</b> Friday, September 28, 2012 11:22 PM<br>
                  <b>To:</b> Discussion of biomass cooking stoves<br>
                  <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Stoves] Fabricated Burn Barrel
                  TLUDS</span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">Dear Tom,</p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">we regularly supply charring kilns
                  made out of used 55 gallon drums. The kilns are based
                  on the TLUD principle. The cost of a kiln plus an
                  extra barrel for storing the char, is about US$100. We
                  have sold more than 100 such kilns in India and have
                  also trained a number of persons from India
                  and Africa. These kilns are so easy to manufacture,
                  that we ask the trainees to photograph and take
                  measurements of our kiln so that they can copy the
                  design. In many instances, people buy a kiln from us,
                  because they feel that their local fabricator would be
                  better able to copy the design from an actual object
                  than from a blue print or a photograph.</p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">The advantage of using 55 gallon
                  drums is that used drums are available at a relatively
                  low cost, and the kilns are portable. Instead of
                  transporting the biomass, one transports the kiln to
                  the location where the biomass is available, and
                  brings back only the charred material, which weighs
                  only a third as much as the biomass.  </p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">Yours</p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">A.D.Karve</p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, Sep 28, 2012 at 11:42 PM,
                  Tom Miles <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:tmiles@trmiles.com" target="_blank">tmiles@trmiles.com</a>>
                  wrote:</p>
                <div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">Am often asked if there is a
                      burn barrel sized TLUD that is commercially
                      fabricated. We’ve seen some great DIY with Doug’s
                      Jolly Roger and others. Is anyone fabricating a 55
                      gal drum sized TLUD that can be used for regular
                      biochar production? If so, what is the cost and
                      availability?</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">Thanks</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888"> </span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">Tom
                        Miles  </span></p>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
                  _______________________________________________<br>
                  Stoves mailing list<br>
                  <br>
                  to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br>
                  <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org"
                    target="_blank">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
                  <br>
                  to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the
                  web page<br>
                  <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org"
                    target="_blank">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
                  <br>
                  for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information
                  see our web site:<br>
                  <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="http://www.bioenergylists.org/"
                    target="_blank">http://www.bioenergylists.org/</a><br>
                  <br>
                </p>
              </div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">
                <br>
                <br clear="all">
                <br>
                -- <br>
                ***<br>
                Dr. A.D. Karve<br>
                Trustee & Founder President, Appropriate Rural
                Technology Institute (ARTI)<br>
                <br>
              </p>
            </div>
          </div>
          <br>
          _______________________________________________<br>
          Stoves mailing list<br>
          <br>
          to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br>
          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
            href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
          <br>
          to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br>
          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org"
            target="_blank">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
          <br>
          for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our
          web site:<br>
          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
            href="http://www.bioenergylists.org/" target="_blank">http://www.bioenergylists.org/</a><br>
          <br>
          <br>
        </blockquote>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
Stoves mailing list

to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>

to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a>

for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our web site:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.bioenergylists.org/">http://www.bioenergylists.org/</a>

</pre>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <br>
      <p class="avgcert" color="#000000" align="left">No virus found in
        this message.<br>
        Checked by AVG - <a moz-do-not-send="true"
          href="http://www.avg.com">www.avg.com</a><br>
        Version: 10.0.1427 / Virus Database: 2441/5298 - Release Date:
        09/29/12</p>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  </body>
</html>