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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dear Stovers,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Perhaps I haven’t thought about all the working of getting stoves to the masses but it seems to me they are all –purchased- for distribution from NGO’s and the like. My thinking is that there need be a catalog of ‘approved’ stoves. Stoves grouped as to fuel type, stove type, in or outdoor, passed efficiency tests etc. Then anyone can design and build a mockup, have it tested and grouped (at their expense) and if all goes well have it in the catalog to be possibly chosen. Then a small part of the cost per stove (production, distribution, on site research etc.) goes to the designer. There is no short of market (so many people need stoves) there must be a better way to make this work than designing a stove from tin cans then running all over the World to sell it like Paul and Dean are dong. We need to define the methods to test stoves to give then the Groups they belong in etc. It’s the Wild West out there!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Frank<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Frank Shields<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Control Laboratories, Inc.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>42 Hangar Way<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Watsonville, CA 95076<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>(831) 724-5422 tel<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>(831) 724-3188 fax<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a href="http://www.biocharlab"><span style='color:blue'>www.biocharlab</span></a>.com<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Paul Anderson<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, November 06, 2012 8:21 AM<br><b>To:</b> Discussion of biomass cooking stoves<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Stoves] The end user<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Dear Paal and all,<br><br>While I agree with Paal, I point out one important additional element. <br><br>The need to have good stoves available for the end users.<br><br>The GACC is involved in many aspects of stoves, but one in particular is the stimulation of the supply of the stoves. Stoves PLURAL and of numerous types. Which stoves, and where, and by whom are part of the basics that GACC is facilitating while not doing nor dictating. Not an easy task. <br><br>So, linking Paal's comments and the GACC, should and can more attention to the end users be given by the GACC? And if so, then how, when, etc.<br><br>Paul<br><br><o:p></o:p></p><pre>Paul S. Anderson, PhD aka "Dr TLUD"<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Email: <a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a> Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Website: <a href="http://www.drtlud.com">www.drtlud.com</a><o:p></o:p></pre><p class=MsoNormal> 11/6/2012 3:31 AM, Paal Wendelbo wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:10.0pt;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Dear Stovers and GACC</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:10.0pt;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The discussion on the list must be crucial for GACC, though the end user for the program naturally dos not participate in the discussion. The academic part of the discussion is really informative and important for us stove designers but probably not that much for the end user. I feel there is too much focus on stoves on the list and to little focus on the end user, the cook and the fuel. What are the priorities of the end user? </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>1.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Price of stoves </span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>2.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Price of fuel</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>3.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Economy </span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>4.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Jobs</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>5.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Waste as fuel</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>6.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Soot, tar on the pot and smoke</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>7.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Practical use of stoves and fuel</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>8.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Design.</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>9.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Boiling beans.</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>10.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Minutes to boil 5 liter of water and MJ</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>11.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Health </span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>12.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Environment</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:10.0pt;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>13.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Biochar</span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:10.0pt;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>It could be useful for all of us and especially for GACC, which has a unique possibility with this program to really change the household energy and health situation for the low income population in the world and in addition open for utilization of combustible waste and income generating activities.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:10.0pt;line-height:13.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Regards Paal W <a href="mailto:paaw@nline.no">paaw@nline.no</a> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Stoves mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="http://www.bioenergylists.org/">http://www.bioenergylists.org/</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>