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<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Dear Christa</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Thanks very much. The figures displayed
easily.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Best wishes,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Kevin</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=stoves@foodandfuel.info href="mailto:stoves@foodandfuel.info">CHRISTA
ROTH</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">Discussion of biomass cooking
stoves</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, January 02, 2013 8:38
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Stoves] Stove ID please -
2-pot stoves - testing needed</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>check if that works
<DIV>happy new Year to all, Christa</DIV>
<DIV><IMG id=fd47f5e7-cff7-4211-99da-7a31b752bc68
src="cid:FF13FBEBAEFD4787866C76E71EF4FFC5@usera594fda0bf" width=640 height=462
apple-height="yes" apple-width="yes"><IMG
id=aa8a7948-75ff-45ec-9ff7-c3d15d50f5c5
src="cid:0FEF13C82C4848D09BB1277466C5B91C@usera594fda0bf" width=640 height=462
apple-height="yes" apple-width="yes"><IMG
id=d474919d-2553-43ea-8afa-8e7358a289a5
src="cid:0CC6666271CB4B91A2DB681A16D7B6EA@usera594fda0bf" width=640 height=462
apple-height="yes" apple-width="yes"><IMG
id=44f35114-cfd8-4901-9e33-d7981647f47a
src="cid:BBC846EF5D984272983B81BF574A4E7F@usera594fda0bf" width=640 height=462
apple-height="yes" apple-width="yes"><IMG
id=42e1fcb9-e8cd-431c-9010-8a1d125d6dfc
src="cid:73FE59D267BA441CAF9F721C67682B78@usera594fda0bf" width=640 height=462
apple-height="yes" apple-width="yes"></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>Am 02.01.2013 um 12:05 schrieb Kevin <<A
href="mailto:kchisholm@ca.inter.net">kchisholm@ca.inter.net</A>>:</DIV><BR
class=Apple-interchange-newline>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV
style="WIDOWS: 2; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; FONT: medium Helvetica; WHITE-SPACE: normal; ORPHANS: 2; LETTER-SPACING: normal; WORD-SPACING: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"
bgcolor="#ffffff">
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Dear Mark</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>They are an Image, but in .png format. I can't open
that format either!! :-(</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Would you be able to re-post them in .jpg
format?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Thanks!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Kevin</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: rgb(0,0,0) 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----</DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(228,228,228); FONT: 10pt arial"><B>From:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A title=mpare@gatech.edu
href="mailto:mpare@gatech.edu">Marc Pare</A></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A
title=stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">Discussion of biomass
cooking stoves</A></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Wednesday, January 02, 2013 1:45
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Re: [Stoves] Stove ID please -
2-pot stoves - testing needed</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>In case anyone needs these: I opened the Sketchup files and rendered
them as images. They're attached.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>You can download Sketchup at <A
href="http://www.sketchup.com/">http://www.sketchup.com/</A></DIV>
<DIV>It's a free 3D modeling software that is designed to be intuitive to
use. It's target audience is architecture drawings, but I've found it nice
to bang out schematics for reports as well.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Marc Paré<BR>B.S. Mechanical Engineering<BR>Georgia Institute of
Technology | Université de Technologie de Compiègne<BR><BR>my cv, etc.
|<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A
href="http://notwandering.com"
target=_blank>http://notwandering.com</A></DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV class=gmail_quote>On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 10:20 AM, Richard
Stanley<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><SPAN dir=ltr><<A
href="mailto:rstanley@legacyfound.org"
target=_blank>rstanley@legacyfound.org</A>></SPAN><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex"
class=gmail_quote>
<DIV style="WORD-WRAP: break-word">Michael,
<DIV>Presuming this is yourself speaking, <A href="http://cnet.com"
target=_blank>cnet.com</A><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>goes even further astray.
<DIV>Oh well, will go to Guatavo for the .skp file direct.</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=HOEnZb><FONT color=#888888>Richard </FONT></SPAN>
<DIV>
<DIV class=h5><BR>
<DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>On Jan 1, 2013, at 8:52 PM, mtrevor wrote:</DIV><BR>
<DIV style="WORD-WRAP: break-word" bgcolor="#ffffff">
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Like I corrected<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A href="http://www.cnet.com/"
target=_blank>www.cnet.com</A> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Michael</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>----- Original Message -----</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: rgb(0,0,0) 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"
dir=ltr>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(228,228,228); FONT: 10pt arial"><B>From:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A
title=rstanley@legacyfound.org href="mailto:rstanley@legacyfound.org"
target=_blank>Richard Stanley</A></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A
title=stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org" target=_blank>Discussion
of biomass cooking stoves</A></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Wednesday, January 02, 2013
2:26 PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Re: [Stoves] Stove ID please
- 2-pot stoves - testing needed</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Michael,
<DIV>Are you sure that this <SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: small"> </SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: small"><A
style="COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline"
href="http://www.cnet.comoc/"
target=_blank>www.cnet.comoc</A></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: small"> </SPAN> is the
right link: I can't open it on my Mac. /Safari server.</DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>Richard</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV> <BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>On Jan 1, 2013, at 1:32 PM, mtrevor wrote:</DIV><BR>
<DIV bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Paul and others if you were having trouble with
Gustavo's sketch up images of the 2 pot stove Goolge Sketch up is
available for free thru downloads at<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A
href="http://www.cnet.comoc/"
target=_blank>www.cnet.comoc</A> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Michael</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Majuor</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: rgb(0,0,0) 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"
dir=ltr>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----</DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(228,228,228); FONT: 10pt arial"><B>From:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A title=psanders@ilstu.edu
href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu" target=_blank>Paul
Anderson</A></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A
title=stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org"
target=_blank>Discussion of biomass cooking stoves</A></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Monday, December 31, 2012
11:26 AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Re: [Stoves] Stove ID
please - 2-pot stoves - testing needed</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Crispin and all,<BR><BR>The Prakti 2-pot unit should be
directly compared with the 2-pot unit from Envirofit.<BR><BR><A
href="http://www.envirofit.org/products/?sub=cookstoves&pid=5"
target=_blank>http://www.envirofit.org/products/?sub=cookstoves&pid=5</A>
(to see a photo).<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<H2>Double-Pot Attachment</H2>
<H2>Features</H2>
<DIV>
<UL>
<LI>The Double pot accessory with chimney is the perfect add-on
for customers who want the portability and ease of using the
single-pot stove, but need the extra cooking area for large
families, festivals, or cooking for visitors.
<LI>The attachment is easily moved onto or off of the stove for
quick change ability but is steady and sturdy while attached.
<LI>The chimney portion can be used as is - to move any minimal
emissions out of the face of the person cooking - or can be
vented out of the home. * Shown with G-3300
cookstove.</LI></UL></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>And I am sure that there are
other 2-pot stoves, but just not being stamped out and with such
smooth edges. Many of us have made such
units.<BR><BR>What is needed is some serious study of these useful
features, whether built into the stove or as an
attachment. Issues to be studied include:<BR>heat
transfer to EACH pot<BR>types of pots used (sit on top or
inserted)<BR>insulation<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><BR>temperatures of the
outside surfaces<BR>fuel efficiencies attributed to the second
pot<BR><BR>And of course, the ways of supplying heat to the 2-pot
stove structure. The fact that both the Prakti and
Envirofit units use Rocket combustion structures does not exclude
use with other combustors, such as<BR>TLUDs and even fossil-fuel
burners.<BR><BR>Important note: These 2-pot structures both
(virtually all of them?) have a chimney because horizontal flow of
the hot gases must eventually have some upward movement to maintain
the draft (exceptions if there are fans in use). For the
TLUD combustors, the chimney is a nice enhancement of the
draft.<BR><BR>I did not understand Crispin's comment about keeping
the smoke and flames together.<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">It
seems to me to be worth investigation the % of smoke that can be
burned by keeping the smoke and flames together for a
while.</SPAN></BLOCKQUOTE>That is true for "stick-burners" like the
Rockets. But TLUDs are "gas-burners" (that make their own
gases in the close-coupled gasifier reactors.) What
would be the best ways to get the best results with Rockets, TLUDs,
or other heat sources?<BR><BR>Regardless, this seems like a great
topic for some research by the now "product-independent"
laboratories for stove testing, such as CREEC and Zamorano and
ARC. But the question is: who will pay for
these tests, and who will release the results? Past
practices have been that "he who pays decides what will be
released." And the chances of having both PRAKTI and
Envirofit pay and allow comparisons are about slim to
none.<BR><BR>And I am not going to pay for it. And the
testing centers get paid nothing for testing unless there are
sponsors.<BR><BR>So, I hope that the GACC will soon finance some
comparative testings of stove STRUCTURES that are not just focused
on the combustion devices. AND then do some testing of
those same STRUCTURES but with different systems of combustion, such
as having Champion or Mwoto or Quad TLUDs under identical 2-pot
structures..<BR><BR>Happy New Year to all!!!<BR><BR>Paul<BR><BR><PRE cols="72">Paul S. Anderson, PhD aka "Dr TLUD"
Email: <A href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu" target=_blank>psanders@ilstu.edu</A> Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website: <A href="http://www.drtlud.com/" target=_blank>www.drtlud.com</A></PRE>On
12/30/2012 4:24 PM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott wrote:<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Dear
Richard in NW Obamaland<U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Agreed.
I was looking at the size of the opening at the top and wondering
how it burned. I have been working on the use of flame tubes
a-la-BLDD6 and earlier versions where the fire is enclosed in a
fairly small round channel.<U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">A
couple of weeks ago I tried installing a 57mm I.D. flame tube in a
horizontal draft two-pot stove (I will add pictures later) to see
if the smoke could be burned post-pot-1. It worked pretty well. I
do not yet have definitive numbers but as a design approach it
definitely worked. There are a number of stoves that have far too
much space after the fire, allowing the smoke and flames to take
separate routs to the outlet.<U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">So
the stove in question has a huge outlet so if smoke manages to get
to a corner, it has ample space to escape to the margins away from
Pot 2. It seems to me to be worth investigation the % of smoke
that can be burned by keeping the smoke and flames together for a
while. There are several stoves with a suitable layout for this.
One is the three-pot stove used in Indonesia consisting of
separate clay round sections with interconnecting tunnels. If the
tunnels were reduced in diameter to the point at which they became
an impediment to gas flow, that would maximise the chance of
burning the smoke. If the flame was entering the tube in the
simple experiment I conducted, the smoke was dramatically reduced
showing a reproducible and consistent
effect.<U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">I
really like the cast iron grate in the Prakti stove with a
thickened front bar that will resist banging from heavy wood
sitting on it.<U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Regards<U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Crispin<U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><U></U><U></U></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>Crispin,<U></U><U></U></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal>This seems to be c similar o what was coming
from the Dutch TOOL foundation in (A ' dam) in the late
70's. They were trying to replicate them thru our center (AATP)
during that time but it never really took
on. <U></U><U></U></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal>Richard Stanley<U></U><U></U></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><U></U><U></U></P></DIV></DIV></DIV><BR>
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<P align=left>No virus found in this message.<BR>Checked by AVG -<SPAN
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