No worries Otto!<div><br></div><div>I don't see the list as a forum for promoting LPG. I use it as a way to stay informed on stove design and whats happening. I like to know what kind of stoves exist that would make a good fit for families in the market I operate. My goal is to bring them clean stoves of their choice. That is why this list is so great! So many of you all are great designers and engineers. I am focusing on developing distribution models for you all to use. I am also happy to contribute to research on consumer behavior for fuel choice. We should have something out this year with the data from Guatemala.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div><br></div><div>Christina<span></span><br><br>On Sunday, May 5, 2013, Otto Formo wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div><div dir="ltr">Dear Christina,<br> <br>Thanks for clearifying your options and ways forward.<br> <br>I just find it a bit od to spend time and efforts to promote LPG on this list, while most oil and gas companies, spend millions to promote their prodcts.<br>
<br>I leave it to STATOIL to promote their fossil fuel products and still considered as an option as fuel for cooking in urban settings.<br> <br>I prefer to promote natural draft gasifiers and suitable biomass as fuel, still not so "well paid" as a marketing consultant for STATOIL or SHELL, but...........:)<br>
<br>To connect rural people to the grid, will take decades and enormous amounts of money in investmens and will most likely not be affordable for 80 % of the population.<br>I do not feel to much "worries" about the Multi National power companies, either.<br>
They will "manage".<br> <br>Thanks<br> <br>Otto<br> <br><div><div></div><hr>Date: Sun, 5 May 2013 11:04:34 -0700<br>From: <a>c_espinosa1@u.pacific.edu</a><br>To: <a>stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>Subject: Re: [Stoves] The price of bottled gas<br>
<br>Hi Otto,<div><br></div><div>I definately consider biomass to be sutable for low income households...I probably wouldn't be part of this list if I didn't. I think that the work people are doing on this listserv is vital and important. I spent two years working on using biomass for households. I believe that families need to be presented with various stove options. Just because I support the use of LPG doesn't mean I am against biomass. I am the most concerned with health impact. I just don't believe that on this listserv we should be promoting not using LPG. We are here to try and save lives and improve health. I think that Kirk Smiths opening comments at the Clean Cooking Forum are very clear about what steps need to be INCLUDED to reach our ultimate health goals. So I believe that we need to as Kirk Smith said, transition a portion of the people that are using purchased wood to gas/electricity. The most dificult task remains developing clean stoves that are affordable for families that don't have enough income to purchase fuel. </div>
<div><br></div><div>My work is focused on designing affordable ways to distribute and adopt stoves, while focusing on a way to increrase houeshold education of HAP. We conducted a survey in Guatemala of 300 households to learn more about fuel use, fuel preference, stacking, fuel perception, willingness to pay, level of education about HAP, etc. </div>
<div><br></div><div>Hope that helps to clear up any confusion.</div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div><br></div><div>Christina<span></span></div><div><br></div><div><br><br>On Sunday, May 5, 2013, Otto Formo wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid">
<div><div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">Cristina,<br><font face="Helvetica">I just noticed your comment on the statement to Paul O:</font><div><div><font face="Helvetica">"</font><font face="Helvetica">Are we not concerned about global warming each time that we switch on a modern gas stove?"</font></div>
<div> </div><div>" <b>Are you saying that poor people shouldn't be allowed to use fossil fuels?"</b></div><div> </div><div>Do you realy consider biomass not suitable for the low income households??</div><div>
</div><div>I am using firewood from the nearby forest and considering instaling a pellet boiler, approximate 30 YEARS after the first Swede started to use his pellet and wood chip burner.</div><div>Well, some people say Sweden has been better off, since VOLVO has moved to China, but still..............:)</div>
<div> </div><div>Norway is exporting 99% of LPG produced to US and Europe.</div><div> </div><div>Thanks</div><div> </div><div>Otto<br></div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div></div><div><div></div><hr>Date: Sun, 5 May 2013 01:41:33 -0700<br>
From: <a>c_espinosa1@u.pacific.edu</a><br>To: <a>stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
Subject: Re: [Stoves] The price of bottled gas<br><br>Hi Paul,<div><br></div><div>Yes Guatemala does have a fair amount of agricultural residues. We worked on designing briquetting models and had a hard time with some of the available types of biomass. I am sure Richard could comment on this more since he started working here with some groups on designing a mix with the kinds of biomass that we have available.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Also the infrastructure requirements for LPG and natural gas are different.</div><div><br></div><div>Here is the FAO breakdown for Guatemala:</div><div><span style="font-family:Helvetica;white-space:nowrap"><a href="http://faostat.fao.org/DesktopDefault.aspx?PageID=339&lang=en&country=89" target="_blank">http://faostat.fao.org/DesktopDefault.aspx?PageID=339&lang=en&country=89</a></span></div>
<div><font face="Helvetica"><span style="white-space:nowrap"><br></span></font></div><div><font face="Helvetica"><span style="white-space:nowrap">The most abundant biomass available here is with sugarcane and banana growers. When we talked with a large company growing </span></font></div>
<div><font face="Helvetica"><span style="white-space:nowrap">bananas they expressed that they were investigating ways to turn the flower plams (I think that is what they are called) into electricity. </span></font></div>
<div>
<font face="Helvetica"><span style="white-space:nowrap">Again, the sugar cane growers I think are using the biomass for the same kinds of things. So Guatemala's two largest sources of </span></font></div><div><font face="Helvetica"><span style="white-space:nowrap">biomass are or are in plans to be utilized for energy. Coffee husks might be one of the more available types. I remember reading </span></font></div>
</div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div> </div></div>
</blockquote></div><br><br>-- <br>Christina Espinosa<br>University of the Pacific '10<br>School of International Studies<br><a href="mailto:c_espinosa1@u.pacific.edu" target="_blank">c_espinosa1@u.pacific.edu</a><br>
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