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<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Dear Erin</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=erin@trmiles.com href="mailto:erin@trmiles.com">Erin Rasmussen</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rongretlarson@comcast.net
href="mailto:rongretlarson@comcast.net">rongretlarson@comcast.net</A> ; <A
title=stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">'Discussion of biomass cooking
stoves'</A> ; <A title=lannych@bellsouth.net
href="mailto:lannych@bellsouth.net">'Lanny Henson'</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:10
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Stoves] Stove
Definition</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=WordSection1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">The EcoKalan
project in the Phillipines is using a "magic box" cooker with a rocket stove
<A href="http://eco-kalan.com">http://eco-kalan.com</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">I see no reason
why you can't do the same thing with a char making stove. </SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><STRONG># This
is a really good point!! "Conventional Testing" basically measures "Energy to
the Pot." Improved testing" seeks to measure </STRONG></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><STRONG>"What
fraction of the fuel energy supplied ends up in the pot?"</STRONG></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><STRONG></STRONG></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><STRONG># A
Testing protocol" that measured "How much fuel energy was supplied to cook a
standard" meal"? would enable combining the benefits of fuel efficient stoves
and such "magic boxes" or "Retained Heat Cookers."</STRONG></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><STRONG># Lanny
Henson has been reporting a lot of his cooking tests in terms of "Grams of
fuel required to cook a meal", such as pinto beans, rice, ragou, etc.
</STRONG></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">Getting a
starch or bean started on a gasifier stove, and then using the remaining
gasifier energy to finish your breakfast while the cooker is saving you from
using your coals to finish cooking your dinner, seems reasonable. </SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><STRONG># I
think that it is "Much Better than reasonable!!!" :-) With a good combustion
system and a good Retained Heat Cooker design, one could probably easily make
a Cooking Stove that was well beyond the best cooking efficiencies of
conventional stove systems.</STRONG></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><STRONG></STRONG></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><STRONG>Best
wishes</STRONG>,</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">Kevin</SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">Erin<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
<A href="mailto:rongretlarson@comcast.net">rongretlarson@comcast.net</A>
[mailto:rongretlarson@comcast.net] <BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, May 02, 2013
3:17 PM<BR><B>To:</B> Discussion of biomass cooking stoves; Erin Rasmussen;
Lanny Henson<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Stoves] Stove
Definition<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Erin -
cc Lanny. Thanks for the addition. I may be wrong, but I don't
think this form of cooker is much in the GACC playbook for WBT4.2.1 drafting
(and maybe shouldn't there). I'll look carefully - as this is by far the
best way to save money and keep CO2 out of the atmosphere. Unfortunately
I don't see a way to tie this cooker into biochar. (This is a
favorite topic for solar cooks.)<BR><BR> But I am only
responding because you were following up with Lanny. Taking his last
line from below </SPAN><I><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 14pt"><BR>
"Just to confuse things, would you call a pig on a stick, over a fire a
stove?"</SPAN></I><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><BR><BR> I would
answer emphatically "no" (as I think we all would), but it should be listed
among the better (and rarely used) ways to make charcoal, whch obviously all
stoves should do..<BR><BR> Going further, there probably is lot to
be gained (for biochar) also by promoting more "fire walking" as practiced in
the South Pacific. But I digress.<BR><BR> Other "cooker"
approaches to advancing biochar?<BR><BR>Ron <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=MsoNormal align=center><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">
<HR id=zwchr align=center SIZE=2 width="100%">
</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">From:
</SPAN></B><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">"Erin Rasmussen"
<<A href="mailto:erin@trmiles.com">erin@trmiles.com</A>><BR><B>To:
</B>"Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <<A
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</A>><BR><B>Sent:
</B>Thursday, May 2, 2013 2:06:48 PM<BR><B>Subject: </B>Re: [Stoves] Stove
Definition<BR><BR><BR><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">We also use
"cooker" when we're talking about retained heat cooking. There's no fire
there, so not a 'stove' but the food still does a fine job of cooking away in
the insulated basket. </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext">Erin
</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
Stoves [<A
href="mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</A>]
<B>On Behalf Of </B>Lanny Henson<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, May 02, 2013 11:24
AM<BR><B>To:</B> Discussion of biomass cooking stoves<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re:
[Stoves] Stove Definition</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt">Kevin, thanks for stirring
the pudding.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt">I believe we are using
“Cooking Stoves” as a term that covers all cooking appliances like ovens,
griddles, grills, roasters, vat cookers and other types of cookers.
</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt">If you said “cooking
appliance” many people would not know what you were talking about, but “stove”
is well known word that translates well.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt">The word “cooker” would
cover stoves, food cooking appliances, as well as non
food, industrial type cookers, so “cooker” may be a good word to toss in
when talking about “stoves”. </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt">Just to confuse things, would
you call a pig on a stick, over a fire a stove?</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt">Lanny</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">----- Original
Message ----- </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4" class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A
title=kchisholm@ca.inter.net href="mailto:kchisholm@ca.inter.net"
target=_blank>Kevin</A> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">To:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A
title=stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org" target=_blank>Discussion of
biomass cooking stoves</A> ; <A title=frank@compostlab.com
href="mailto:frank@compostlab.com" target=_blank>Frank Shields</A>
</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Cc:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A
title=Jetter.Jim@epamail.epa.gov href="mailto:Jetter.Jim@epamail.epa.gov"
target=_blank>'Jim Jetter'</A> ; <A title=wastemin1@verizon.net
href="mailto:wastemin1@verizon.net" target=_blank>'Hugh McLaughlin'</A> ; <A
title=stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org" target=_blank>'Discussion of
biomass cooking stoves'</A> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Sent:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> Tuesday, April
30, 2013 12:50 PM</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Subject:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> [Stoves] Stove
Definition</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Dear
List</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Just what
is a "stove?"</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I would
suggest that it is important that we all know what a "stove" is, when we
attempt to determine the difference between a "good stove" and a "poor
stove.'</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">When we
ask Mr. Google, we get more than 7 million hits. However, the most common
definitions seem to be typified by the one at</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
href="http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/stove"
target=_blank>http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/stove</A></SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">"
1<EM><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">a</SPAN></EM><SPAN
class=ssens> </SPAN><STRONG><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">:</SPAN></STRONG><SPAN
class=ssens> a portable or fixed apparatus that burns fuel or uses
electricity to provide heat (as for cooking or heating)
</SPAN>"</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">At <A
href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/"
target=_blank>http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</A> , the stated
purpose of the site is:</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">"</SPAN>Our site is dedicated to
helping people develop better stoves for cooking with biomass fuels in
developing regions.<SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">
"</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">What
about accepting the Merriam-Webster definition for a
"stove?"</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Would
anyone have a better definition for a "stove?"</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Best
wishes,</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Kevin</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=MsoNormal align=center>
<HR align=center SIZE=2 width="100%">
</DIV>
<P style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"
class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<BR>Stoves
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<P>
<HR>
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