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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>Dear Crispin,<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>I do understand what he meant. My point is we know all the calculations or we talk like we know them. We know all the products put out from stoves (Tom Miles published a book full of them) , the thermo properties of the stove body materials, air flow and eddies and all this stuff – Now What? We need numbers! Place a stove on a bench and what XYZ coordinate do you put the temperature sensor or pull a sample of gas for analysis? For small stoves finding this exact location more difficult than larger stoves because of more rapid changes in conditions in both distance and time. This location defined such that all labs get the same values. And what of all the many, many complex chemicals do we test for? Etc. etc. <o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>We can’t test for everything we need for the formulas we have and can’t test for them at every XYZ coordinate. So we need ways to cut to the chase with the simple equipment we have available. <o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>That’s why I took liberties with the suggested Model and Method for the ‘Saving the WBT’ discussion. <o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>Regards<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>Frank<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>Frank Shields<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>Control Laboratories; Inc.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>42 Hangar Way<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>Watsonville, CA 95076<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>(831) 724-5422 tel<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>(831) 724-3188 fax<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>frank@biocharlab.com<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'>www.controllabs.com<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#003300'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Crispin Pemberton-Pigott<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 22, 2013 6:34 PM<br><b>To:</b> 'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Stoves] Excess air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-CA style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dear Frank<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-CA style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-CA style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I think Philip was talking about the calculations we do. His point was that if we know how to calculate it properly, why would we do something else?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-CA style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-CA style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Regards<br>Crispin<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-CA style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-CA style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'> Stoves [<a href="mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Frank Shields<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 22, 2013 8:11 PM<br><b>To:</b> 'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Stoves] Excess air<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-CA><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>Dear Philip,<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><snip></span></b><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>So if the big stovers can use such a measure, why can’t we?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>[Frank >] <o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>Great question…</span></i></b><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in'><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>1)</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.0pt;color:#993366'> </span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>Because little stoves change conditions in seconds<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in'><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>2)</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.0pt;color:#993366'> </span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>Because little stoves change conditions per centimeters<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in'><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>3)</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.0pt;color:#993366'> </span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>Because the Start and Cool-down are larger variables for little stoves when the run time is as short as cooking a small meal. <o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>Where do we put our detectors for taking measurements and how quickly can we control (adjust) the variables (primary and secondary air) for making corrections. Working on that is the goal as I see it. <o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>Frank<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'>. <o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoListParagraph><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Kind regards<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Philip<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></body></html>