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<body class='hmmessage'><div dir='ltr'>Dear Paal,<BR> <BR>I think mr. Grinnell means us, People whom have been staying and living in Africa for more than a decade.....................<BR>Some people think and seriously means, that "Development work" has a glance of some kind of a "romance", linked to a good potion of naivity.<BR>Just like any other "beliver".<BR> <BR>May be they are correct, but let them be strong in their faith of Centralsation and lets us try to convince others that there are quite a few different paths on the way to succeed.<BR> <BR>Kindly<BR> <BR>Otto F.<br> <BR><div><hr id="stopSpelling">From: paaw@online.no<br>To: stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org<br>Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2014 10:38:37 +0100<br>Subject: Re: [Stoves] [Ethos] ETHOS Discussion about decentalized stoveefforts<br><br>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 10pt; line-height: 13pt;"><span lang="EN-US"><font style="font-size: 11pt;">Richard Gr.</font></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 10pt; line-height: 22pt;"><span lang="EN-US"><font style="font-size: 11pt;">With
ref. to your mail of 10.01, could you please explain the words “<i>others that are more "romantic"
approach</i>” in this context. It will be of interest for the further
discussion.</font></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 10pt; line-height: 13pt;"><span lang="EN-US"><font style="font-size: 11pt;">Regards Paal W</font></span></p>
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<div><b>From:</b> <a title="richard.grinnell@gmail.com" href="mailto:richard.grinnell@gmail.com">Richard Grinnell</a> </div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Friday, January 03, 2014 4:57 PM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a title="ethos@vrac.iastate.edu" href="mailto:ethos@vrac.iastate.edu">ethos@vrac.iastate.edu</a> </div>
<div><b>Cc:</b> <a title="stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org" href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">Discussion of biomass cooking
stoves</a> </div>
<div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Stoves] [Ethos] ETHOS Discussion about decentalized
stoveefforts</div></div></div>
<div> </div></div>
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<div dir="ltr">All,
<div> </div>
<div>This can be a great topic for discussion and I see many points of view that
are valid and others that are more "romantic" in approach. I have believed
that the best approach is mixed between centralized and decentralized, depending
on the level of technology available, knowledge, biomass production potential
for fuel, etc. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>See you all at ETHOS!</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Richard</div></div>
<div class="ecxgmail_extra"><br><br>
<div class="ecxgmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 1, 2014 at 2:33 PM, Paul Anderson <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu" target="_blank">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="ecxgmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid;">Ben,<br><br>Please
provide more info about that suggestion/recommendation. When was<br>it, and to
whom? Any viable contacts that could be reached for
further<br>clarification?<br><br>In general, the decentralized elements are
not "organized" and have far<br>fewer funds. Much of it is
lobbying and money to get decisions that<br>favor those who can lobby and have
the money already. Because that is<br>not likely to change,
what strategies are possible for decentralized<br>efforts even in relatively
small geographic areas?<br><br>Paul<br><br>Doc / Dr TLUD
/ Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD<br>Email: <a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a><br>Skype:
paultlud Phone: <a target="_blank">+1-309-452-7072</a><br>Website: <a href="http://www.drtlud.com" target="_blank">www.drtlud.com</a><br><br>On
12/31/2013 8:51 PM, Ben Blevins wrote:<br>> Deloitte contractors suggested
decentralized for various reasons, there consulting was rejected because the
finding did not reinforce the message of mass production and distribution by
development industry players.<br>><br>> B<br>><br>><br>> On Dec
31, 2013, at 6:34 PM, Paul Anderson <<a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>>
wrote:<br>><br>>> Dear Paal, and all,<br>>><br>>> As much
as I can agree with Paal's statements, but I think the cards are stacked
against the success of decentralized efforts.<br>>><br>>> The
issue that Paal raises about the need to have decentralized production of
stoves (and fuels) is a touchy topic because the "model" of the affluent world
is for centralized industrial production. That centralized model
is certainly a cornerstone of the GACC and WB and many who feel that the
model of the affluent world will work to resolve major issues in the
developing world. And they control access to most of the funding.
And they present very convincing arguments. (If they could not,
they would not be in control of the situation.)<br>>><br>>> It
would be good to have some examples of decentralized efforts having major
impacts. Maybe the spread of the Kenyan ceramic jiko (KCJ) is one
example.<br>>><br>>> I will be at ETHOS and willing for such
discussions if others step forward wanting to discuss this informally as an ad
hoc sub-group.<br>>><br>>> Paul<br>>><br>>> Doc
/ Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD<br>>>
Email: <a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a><br>>> Skype:
paultlud Phone: <a target="_blank">+1-309-452-7072</a><br>>> Website: <a href="http://www.drtlud.com" target="_blank">www.drtlud.com</a><br>>><br>>> On 12/31/2013 10:15
AM, <a href="mailto:paaw@online.no">paaw@online.no</a> wrote:<br>>>>
On Tue, 31 Dec 2013 08:12:54 -0700,<br>>>> <a href="mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
wrote:<br>>>><br>>>>> Due to health and age it will not
be possible for me to participate, but after 30 years working with task and
followed the discussion at Stove list I have come to this
conclusion.<br>>>>><br>>>>> There has to be a
discussion at ETHOS about centralized or decentralized activities regarding
fuel and stove production with a view on the enormous unemployment in
developing countries. Taken into consideration the high demands of clean
combustion, pellets will be the future biomass fuel for simple clean burning
such as TLUD ND and FD. Energy forestry and agriculture energy production
together collection of waste biomass of different types will give a lot of new
needed jobs.<br>>>>><br>>>>>
· Registration of local waste
combustible biomass.<br>>>>><br>>>>>
· Use of local
resources<br>>>>><br>>>>>
· Biochar production by
cooking.<br>>>>><br>>>>> That will be the best way for
GACC Stove program to support the low income groups all around the
worl<br>>>>><br>>>>> Best regards Paal Wendelbo <a href="mailto:paaw@online.no">paaw@online.no</a><br>>>>
_______________________________________________<br>>>> Stoves mailing
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