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<body class='hmmessage'><div dir='ltr'>Dear Philip,<BR>First, <BR>thanks for confirming my observations from Southern part of Africa and <BR>secondly remindming me about the "wonderer", "looking" into the hot Storage basket...............<BR> <BR>Due to heavy poaching in Zambia, wild animals are no longer "a problem".........<BR> <BR>Paal spend more than 10 years in Africa, in refugee camps and among the "People", not in five stars hotels.<BR>I like to listen and learn from experienced People, sorry.<BR> <BR>Solar cookers for heating water, yes...........for Cooking??<BR> <BR>We are celebrating Our 200 years Independence from Denmark and Sweden to morrow and I wish you all Happy Aniversery and a Nice weekend.<BR> <BR>Otto <br> <BR><div><hr id="stopSpelling">Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 07:54:20 +0300<br>From: cookswelljikos@gmail.com<br>To: stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org<br>Subject: Re: [Stoves] Solar cookers<br><br><div dir="ltr">Dear Philip - <div><br>I could not agree with you more, one thing I find I often repeat to expert expats when they ask why Cookswell does not promote solar cookers is that Biomass ( read photosynthesis) is nature's own beautiful solar cooker - it has had millions of years of R&D, a wonderful LCA profile and, as with trees, provides so much more in the form of water retention, shade, timber, habitat..etc''..... I would like to see a piece of plastic/aluminium do all that and cook dinner! </div>
<div><br></div><div>Thats my two cents.</div><div><br>Teddy</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div class="ecxgmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><b>Cookswell Jikos</b><br><a href="http://www.cookswell.co.ke" target="_blank">www.cookswell.co.ke</a></div>
<div><a href="http://www.facebook.com/CookswellJikos" target="_blank">www.facebook.com/CookswellJikos</a></div><div><a href="http://www.kenyacharcoal.blogspot.com" target="_blank">www.kenyacharcoal.blogspot.com</a></div><div>
Mobile: +254 700 380 009 <br></div><div>Mobile: +254 700 905 913</div><div>P.O. Box 1433, Nairobi 00606, Kenya</div><div><img width="71" height="96" src="https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-mFnK50B4oS8/UUrgJle8z9I/AAAAAAAAB_o/OUjLd7wrKPg/s133/Cookswell+Logo.PNG"><br>
</div><div><font color="#008000" face="Tms Rmn">Save trees - think twice before printing</font><font color="#008000" face="Tms Rmn" size="1">.</font><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br><br><br></div></div></div>
<br><br><div class="ecxgmail_quote">On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 12:04 AM, Philip Lloyd <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:plloyd@mweb.co.za" target="_blank">plloyd@mweb.co.za</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="ecxgmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid;">
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; font-size: 11pt;'>As this is a bioenergy list, I hope we can now leave solar
cookers in the light of Otto’s very sensible comments. Our own
experience confirms Otto’s observations in every detail. Solar
cookers don’t work in the Sub-Saharan situation partly because the staple
foods don’t do very well in solar cookers; partly because the cooks
actually enjoy being involved in food preparation, and are unhappy leaving the
food to cook where they can’t taste, stir, smell the process; and partly
because this is Africa, and if some wanderer doesn’t steal your food,
then there is a real prospect that a monkey or some other animal will.
Tellingly, one failed experimenter wrote “The road to the north is littered
with abandoned solar cookers!” Stick to stoves, brother stovers –
the solar route has been extensively tried and repeatedly failed.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; font-size: 11pt;'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'>Prof Philip Lloyd</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'>Energy Institute</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'>Cape Peninsula University of Technology</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'>PO Box 652, Cape Town 8000</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'>Tel:021 460 4216</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'>Fax:021 460 3828</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'>Cell: 083 441 5247</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; font-size: 11pt;'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; font-size: 11pt;'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><b><span style='font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'>From:</span></b><span style='font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; font-size: 10pt;'> Stoves
[mailto:<a href="mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org" target="_blank">stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Otto Formo<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 15 May 2014 09:00<br>
<b>To:</b> Stoves Bioenergylist<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Stoves] solar cooking in time Re: Others may know this but
it new to me WILSON SOLARCOOKER<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span lang="NO-BOK" style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>Dear
Dieter,</span><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span lang="NO-BOK" style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'> </span><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>I am very much aware of the baskets
for hot storage.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'> Low
income households are not entitled to the luxury to plan their cooking, hours
and days ahead.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>Meat
or beef (“Relish”) are expensive and hard to find.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>As far as I
know, in most part of southern Africa, these households among others, use some
kind of a “porridge” made from corns (Maize).<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>That
one has to be eaten right after preparation or it will turn into
“cement”, just like potato mash.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>In Zambia
(and many other African countries), they used it daily as the staple food
source, called Nzima.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>No
access to a fridge or freezers, and occasionally just “fresh” meat.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>They also
need to utilize the daylight for work in the fields, also collecting water and
firewood.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>After
dark its time for cooking, that’s the fact.<br>
You hardly find people “outdoor” after dark, apart from illegal
charcoal producers and poachers.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>The daily
routine is not addressed by the clock, but actually by the sunrise and sunset.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>Just what
we were doing in Norway, a hundred years ago……before electricity
and tap water.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><br>
Have you ever stayed in a village and listen to the hens start
“calling”, just before sunrise and life begin to become active
again? <br>
<br>
May be in a refugee camp, you can find differences from this pattern, but
that’s not a “normal” situation.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'> All
the best<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>Otto<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><br>
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div align="center" class="ecxMsoNormal" style="text-align: center;"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>
<hr width="100%" size="3" align="center">
</span></div>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>Date:
Thu, 15 May 2014 14:08:01 +0200<br>
From: <a href="mailto:doseifert@googlemail.com" target="_blank">doseifert@googlemail.com</a><br>
To: <a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org" target="_blank">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
Subject: [Stoves] solar cooking in time Re: Others may know this but it new to
me WILSON SOLARCOOKER<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<div>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Courier New"; font-size: 10pt;'>Dear
Otto and list,</span><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Courier New"; font-size: 10pt;'> </span><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<pre>The answer to Paal’s question "What shall you do With a solar cooker, when the sun set and People like to have their warm supper <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>after a long day in the fields?" is very simple: The meal was prepared in the time when the sun was shining, than the pots <u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>were transferred to hay boxes/hay baskets and all is ready and warm for eating just when people arrive (described e.g. in the book "Fireless Cookery" Seattle 1981)<u></u><u></u></pre><pre>In the case of cooking with firewood instead of that, the meal has to be cooked and people have to wait hungry or they have to collect firewood. <u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre> <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>In 2011 my wife noted the number of days she cooked with our parabolic cooker (Alsol 1.4) with 1.4 m reflector diameter. <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>On 157 days she cooked all meals of the day, she baked and made conserves and she did not touch her electric stove in the kitchen, <u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>because solar cooking in the garden gives more pleasure, needs less attention etc. In regions with scarcity of firewood <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>there is regularly more sunshine per year than here in Upper Bavaria.<u></u><u></u></pre>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Courier New"; font-size: 10pt;'> </span><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'>I think
that traditions (also e.g. that the rice has to taste of smoke etc.) should be
abandoned before the last tree disappeared.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><br>
With best wishes<br>
Dieter<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><br>
<br>
Am 14.05.2014 21:35, schrieb Otto Formo:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote><pre>Michael N,<u></u><u></u></pre><pre> <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>There are a lot of good ideas out there, but if they are not put into practice or action, what`s the point.....................?<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre> <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>I was very dissapointed to find out that this was a "scam" and fake in broad daylight.<u></u><u></u></pre><pre> <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>Like Paal used to say:<u></u><u></u></pre><pre>"What shall you do With a solarcooker, when the sun set and People like to have their warm supper after a long day in the fields?"<u></u><u></u></pre><pre> <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>YES, that could have been solved by the Wilson Solar Cooker.<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>Now, the only Mr. Wilson, I will remember from the US, is the nighbour to Dennis..........that`s all.........:)<u></u><u></u></pre><pre> <u></u><u></u></pre><pre>May be that`s the best way too.<u></u><u></u></pre><pre>Otto<u></u><u></u></pre><pre> <u></u><u></u></pre><pre><u></u> <u></u></pre></blockquote>
<p class="ecxMsoNormal"><span style='font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";'><br>
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