<html><head><base href="x-msg://128/"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Er.. Crispin,<div><br></div><div>Agreed, population reduction and higher quality of life--as measured by ownership of more things are on the horizon, it does not really serve as a comprehensive predictor for future happiness for mankind. It side-steps or altogether misses the more sticky sociological and social economic insights who owns what and how decisions are distributed ,managed and reconciled. Thats the core stuff of humanity. Its all about feeling free and safe and socially motivated enough to get into life --to interact and play it forward. </div><div><br></div><div>These values and incentives are neither store bought nor a centrally distributed set of solutions </div><div><br></div><div>You can argue climate change till the cows come in but amidst lesser certainty of climate and basic resources, and far more importantly, amidst increasing lack of certainty about effective, responsibility and transparent management of them by increasingly distant centers of decision making-whether corporate and/or government–, the future is not to me particularly a happy one. <div><br></div><div> Concern and conscience has increasingly been hijacked by privately owned media or politicized to the ends of politicians equally owned and the societies potential for compassion subtended by media sound byte or altogether usurped by individual interests. : There is less chance of participation in ones own governance and trust in the common good now than in our own recent history. <div><br></div><div>Hate crimes, profiling, religious zealotic differences have resulted in unprecedented segmentation of local communities, cultures and nation all over the globe.</div><div><br></div><div>If Harry Dent is just crunching numbers to project opportunities for economic investments, thats one thing: To extrapolate from those metrics to a brighter future for all, is a bit of a stretch…</div><div><br></div><div>In a word it's a good deal more complicated than economics. How we secure a future which embodies local ownership, and as well, regional and global responsibility for our actions is not going to rest with any present-day model of governance. There is a lot of well networked thought and action around the notion of act locally exchange globally and grow through networks rather than pyramids of power…but thats another subject even further form the focus of this group than our present divergence..</div><div><br></div><div>Sure, reduced population much eases the stress on resources but it is the distribution of these resources–and further, the participation and equitable and transparent and inclusive ownership of that process which determines more, the happiness quotient of the future than mere economic metrics, no matter how extensive they may be.</div><div><br></div><div>Permittame,</div><div><br></div><div>Richard Stanley</div><div>=================</div><div><br><div><div>On Sep 3, 2014, at 11:45 AM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: 'Stone Sans Sem ITC TT'; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div bgcolor="white" lang="EN-CA" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1; "><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Dear Kirk<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">With all those things taken into consideration, the Malthusians have it wrong. The UN has observed that with development and security of person, people have far fewer children. The global population is predicted to peak in the year 2050 at about 9 billion and will be just below its present level by 2100.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">At present the world produces enough food to feed a population of 18 billion and the greater portion of it is wasted. The study of demographics is well developed and the consequences of its changes have been discussed at length by Harry S Dent in a series of books on investment and national economies.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">The predictions of Paul Erlich have all been falsified within my lifetime. The future just isn’t as dark as it used to be. Be happy. If you are not happy in this day, for what day are you waiting in which to be happy?<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Regards<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Crispin<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div><div style="border-right-style: none; border-bottom-style: none; border-left-style: none; border-width: initial; border-color: initial; border-top-style: solid; border-top-color: rgb(225, 225, 225); border-top-width: 1pt; padding-top: 3pt; padding-right: 0mm; padding-bottom: 0mm; padding-left: 0mm; "><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>kgharris<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Thursday, September 04, 2014 1:04 AM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Discussion of biomass cooking stoves<br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [Stoves] health impact?<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Hi all,</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "> <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">I was wondering what happens when all the people whos lives are saved add their demand on an already stressed environment. If 10,000 lives are saved that is 10,000 more mouths to feed and 10,000 more people cutting down forests. That's today, 20 years from now it will be even more as the saved children begin their own families, and in 40 years even more. I asked a friend about this and he, being a retired high school teacher, said that the stoves must be accompanied by education. Any thought on what education would be good?</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "> <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Kirk Harris,</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-right: 0mm; margin-left: 0mm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; margin-top: 0mm; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Santa Rosa, CA. USA</span><o:p></o:p></div></div></div>_______________________________________________<br>Stoves mailing list<br><br>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br><a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:<br><a href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</a><br><br></div></span></div><br></div></div></div></body></html>