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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Crispin,<br>
<br>
Your reply is appreciated.<br>
<br>
1. I meant to say that only one star IN EACH CATEGORY is
needed. That is a good system.<br>
<br>
2. Crispin wrote:
<blockquote type="cite"><span style="line-height: initial;">Some
80% of households use their domestic cooking stove to earn
money. Far more fuel is burned per day than just the cooking
needs. If the charcoal market existed (it doesn't) they could
produce lots of it from biomass presently burned to get rid of
it (like Kaliandra). </span></blockquote>
Please provide any documentation about how that 80% number was
determined. I think that eaaaaaven 50% would be high, and would
be a favorable indicator for improving cookstoves to obtain lower
operating costs and cleaner emissions related to income earning.<br>
<br>
The LACK of a charcoal market in an environment of abundant
biomass is interesting but probably not unique. And perhaps the
volcanic soils of Indonesia would not benefit much from biochar.
This could become a separate discussion topic some day.<br>
<br>
3. I am curious about the calculation of the energy content in a
kg of biomass fuel. The example discussed is the Albasia pellet,
but the calculation method could be applied to other biomass.
Much of DRY woody biomass is stated to have 16 to 18 MJ/kg. But
if it is to be "de-rated" (or adjusted) to approx 12 MJ/kg, (and
not just because of moisture content) that would have major impact
on all subsequent calculations of efficiencies. I read your
explanation:
<blockquote type="cite">Because the additional work of removing
moist
&n
bsp; &nbs
p;
ure and volatiles from raw fuel to make char, the effective
heating power of a 'missing kg of fuel' is only 12 and a bit MJ.
That is not the heating power of the pyrolysis gases because
some of the carbon is burned. It is the net heat released with
everything considered. </blockquote>
For purposes of having valid comparable test results, I am glad
that the system in Indonesia is uniformly applied to all of the
stoves. But for purposes of comparison with any other testing
methods (or even to question the MJ/kg adjustment itself), the
adjustment is still not clear to me. Not that I matter. I
would be happy if others are in agreement with the method in
Indonesia. I hope that this calculation is further explained and
openly discussed.<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>
Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.drtlud.com">www.drtlud.com</a></pre>
On 11/27/2014 12:50 AM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:COL401-EAS30BD8A7F57DD0266F8D46FB1710@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
<div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
'Slate Pro', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align:
initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Dear Paul</div>
<div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
'Slate Pro', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align:
initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br>
</div>
<div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
'Slate Pro', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align:
initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Just a couple of
clarification notes. </div>
<br>
<div id="_originalContent" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255,
255);">
<meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">>1. A stove only
needs to get one star (Indonesia system) to be eligible to
be included in the up-coming national program (first with 2
pilot locations). </span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">The stove has to get a
star in all three categories: fuel saving, PM reduction and
CO reduction. In order to get to 'be tested' it must first
pass the Indonesian National Standard which is 'SNI'. It has
different metrics and uses a SeTAR standard operating
procedure for part of it. The CSI test is more difficult to
pass. </span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br name="BB10"
caretmarkerset="INVALID"
class="markedForCaretMarkerRemoval">
</span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The stars are 'paid for' individually although there has to
be one for each category. It is not like the IWA tier system
which basically requires compliance across a tier (I think).
It also has 9 metrics, not three. </div>
<div><br>
>The people, the customers, those who ultimately count,
will know that a stove makes charcoal. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>There is one existing opportunity which is being exploited
on a small scale.</div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br name="BB10"
caretmarkerset="INVALID"
class="markedForCaretMarkerRemoval">
</span></div>
<div>>So, getting at least one star is crucial, and Crispin
has said that some TLUDs can accomplish that. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>See above. The minimum is 3. After that there are 6 more
available. <br>
<br>
>It does the required cooking task using 1174 grams of fuel
which is Albasia Pellets at 7.2% moisture content MC, which is
84.5 g of moisture, resulting in 1090 dry weight. <br>
<br>
It is actually much more complicated than that. The stove is
loaded with quite a lot of fuel left from a previous test,
more raw fuel, and the mix loses 1174 g of fuel, net. The
moisture is actually 5.21% but while making charcoal, it is
dried and that mo drying the raw
fuel, the effective moisture level of what is burned is higher
than the raw fuel moisture. I hope you can follow that. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Because the additional work of removing
moist &nbs
p;
&n
bsp;
ure and volatiles from raw fuel to make char, the effective
heating power of a 'missing kg of fuel' is only 12 and a bit
MJ. That is not the heating power of the pyrolysis gases
because some of the carbon is burned. It is the net heat
released with everything considered. </div>
<div><br name="BB10" caretmarkerset="INVALID"
class="markedForCaretMarkerRemoval">
</div>
<div>>370 divided by 1090 is 34% charcoal yield (dry weight
basis). </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>That is 1% less than the minimum yield for charcoal
imported into the EU so I don't think it is particularly
high. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>However it could be partially charred - at least some of
it. This method is not the ideal way to analyse charcoal or
pellet stoves. The 'Burn Out Method' I designed for BP
(described in an ETHOS presentation by Penn Taylor) is much
better for pellet stoves because it doesn't require separation
of char vs non-char. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">> And if the
household does one additional but smaller cooking task with
that stove, then at least 500 grams (at least half a
kilogram, more than one pound) of char can be produced per
day per household. </span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">Some 80% of households
use their domestic cooking stove to earn money. Far more
fuel is burned per day than just the cooking needs. If the
charcoal market existed (it doesn't) they could produce lots
of it from biomass presently burned to get rid of it (like
Kaliandra). </span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br name="BB10"
caretmarkerset="INVALID"
class="markedForCaretMarkerRemoval">
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">>Each applicant for
testing was allowed to specify what fuel was to be used in
the testing. </span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">They can specify
pellets or stick wood, and say how it is to be prepared
(cut). All the wood is teak and all the pellets are Albasia.
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">>So, to Ron I say
that the decision to treat resultant charcoal as "no longer
being the original fuel" is okay. It is one
interpretation. Just as the WBT procedure that give credit
to the energy in the charcoal is also one interpretation. </span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">The IWA labels the
energy 'fuel/energy consumption'. This is misleading. Not as
bad as the WBT which called it 'fuel consumed'. Don't think
people have not noticed this discrepancy. </span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"> >It will be nice
when BOTH interpretations are clearly stated in the rest
results of any tested stove. </span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">Well, one is the heat
transfer efficiency and one is the equivalent of the fuel
consumption. They are both valid numbers if correctly
calculated, but they are very different metrics. </span></div>
<div> <br>
>Happy Thanksgiving Day to everyone!! </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Ditto!</div>
<div><span style="line-height: initial;">Crispin </span></div>
<br>
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