<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75">Hi stovers. This topic of inhaling fine particles is much more complex than simply affecting the lungs. It also affects the brain directly. </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75">I did some research on how they lodge in brain by breaking the blood brain barrier. Last year I wrote an article on this in Times of India. . Though it was written from the point of view of Pranayam (breathing exercise) but the references in the article should throw light on the issue of inhalation of the small particles.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75"><a href="http://www.nariphaltan.org/pranayam.pdf">www.nariphaltan.org/pranayam.pdf</a></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75">Cheers.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#351c75">Anil</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Jun 21, 2015 at 12:34 AM, Frank Shields <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:franke@cruzio.com" target="_blank">franke@cruzio.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt">Dear Andrew and Crispin, Stovers,</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt">All you say does complicate things.
We have:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:16.0pt">1)<span style="font-size:7pt;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span><span style="font-size:16.0pt">toxic volatiles; gases that to measure requires
scrubbers of different types and GC-MS type equipment. So that is out of our
range of tests but I think we work around that much like the drinking water
industry. They test for only fecal
coliform(FC) and use it as an indicator. That is if FC is low they consider all the toxic microbes also low. So if we show the air clean of particles we
can consider the combustion process is also destroying the organic gases(?).</span></p><p><span style="font-size:16pt">2)<span style="font-size:7pt;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span><span style="font-size:16pt">Droplets; These are water and/or condensed tars. They
hit a surface and water evaporates and the organic fraction is left as a
coating to soon be incorporated into tissue or blood stream. </span></p><p><span style="font-size:16pt">3)<span style="font-size:7pt;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span><span style="font-size:16pt">Inorganic ash; very fine mineral material that may, or
not, dissolve in water. Likely harmless chemically but can block airflow.</span></p><p><span style="font-size:16pt">4)<span style="font-size:7pt;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span><span style="font-size:16pt">Soot; organic carbon that can block airflow and
migrate into lungs.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt">It seems testing volatile
toxins are out. It seems determining
size of particles meaningless if there are droplets or fog. The problems are both blocking airflow in the
lungs and organic materials. If agreed
we need to test the filter blockage (like the modified SDI test I mentioned)
and weighing the filtered material and determined percent organic material to
percent inorganic ash. (if using
cellulose filter we heat to 550c and measure inorganic ash left and if using
glass fiber filters we heat to 550c and determine weight loss as organic). <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt">So we have a (1) SDI type
measurement and (2) percent organic and (3) inorganic trapped on the filter as Test Results. If the SDI type measurement Passes (agreed upon air volume does not
reduce air flow as agreed upon value) the other two values are not necessary.
Something like that?<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt">Thanks</span></p><div>Frank</div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt"><br></span></p>
Frank Shields<br><div><a href="mailto:franke@cruzio.com" target="_blank">franke@cruzio.com</a><br><br>
</div></font></span><div><div class="h5">
<br><div><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Jun 20, 2015, at 10:35 AM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott <<a href="mailto:crispinpigott@outlook.com" target="_blank">crispinpigott@outlook.com</a>> wrote:</div><br><div>
<div style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);line-height:initial">
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
Dear Andrew and Frank</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
<br>
</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
Please consider that many of the 'particles' are not solid. Because the N American standards concentrated of 'dry dust' measurements taken above 400 degrees, there is a natural tendency to think of particles as little bits of carbon or sand. </div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
<br>
</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
Condensed particles are like droplets of fog that appear below 400 which is why 400 was chosen to eliminate them!</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
<br>
</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
When they get to the lung surface they stick like fog condensation on a metal plate. They are no longer particles but chemical deposits. They don't retain their integrity and wander around like bits of sand. They blend in. </div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
<br>
</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
Most of the PM from a coal of wood fire is condensed particles not dry dust. Exposure to PM and disease estimates and 'what might be' are not obvious because there really are three things in that mix: condensed droplets of liquids/chemicals, black carbonaceous
particles and other organic particles. BC and OC. </div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
<br>
</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
Obviously it is simplistic to group everything together. The particles emitted at the end of a burn will probably be very different from those emitted at the beginning. The dose-responses will be different too.
</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
<br>
</div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
Lots of work still needed. </div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
Regards </div>
<div style="width:100%;font-size:initial;font-family:Calibri,'Slate Pro',sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);text-align:initial;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
Crispin </div>
<br>
<div>
<div>[Default] On Fri, 19 Jun 2015 11:55:13 -0700,Frank Shields<br>
<<a href="mailto:franke@cruzio.com" target="_blank">franke@cruzio.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
>Thinking the smoke effects the lungs by plastering and clogging the lungs with surface particles. Could be effected more by tars and flat shaped than weight or size - but likely a combination of all.
<br>
<br>
Frank I'm by no means genned up on this subject but I think it's the<br>
fact that the sooty particles are so small that they can migrate<br>
through the mucous membrane walls. Once in the cells their mutagenic<br>
properties can affect cell division.<br>
<br>
AJH<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Stoves mailing list<br>
<br>
to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br>
<a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org" target="_blank">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
<br>
to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br>
<a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org" target="_blank">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
<br>
for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:<br>
<a href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/" target="_blank">http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</a><br>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>Stoves mailing list<br><br>to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br><a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org" target="_blank">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br><a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org" target="_blank">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br><br>for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:<br><a href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/" target="_blank">http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</a><br><br></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div><br>_______________________________________________<br>
Stoves mailing list<br>
<br>
to Send a Message to the list, use the email address<br>
<a href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
<br>
to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page<br>
<a href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a><br>
<br>
for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:<br>
<a href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</a><br>
<br>
<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature">Nimbkar Agricultural Research Institute (NARI)<br>Tambmal, Phaltan-Lonand Road<br>P.O.Box 44<br>Phaltan-415523, Maharashtra, India<br>Ph:91-2166-222396/220945/222842<br><a href="mailto:e-mail%3Anariphaltan@gmail.com" target="_blank">e-mail:nariphaltan@gmail.com</a><br> <a href="mailto:nariphaltan@nariphaltan.org" target="_blank">nariphaltan@nariphaltan.org</a><br><br><a href="http://www.nariphaltan.org" target="_blank">http://www.nariphaltan.org</a><br></div>
</div>