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<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Crispin,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>My original statement was to point out how
the increase in ambient room temperature had changed the turn-down
performance of the stove. This is an important topic if the stove
principles are going to have any effect in hot tropical countries. If you
can comment on this I would be happy to learn from your experience, but please
stop hijacking my posts and misdirecting attention to cater to your agenda
against the current test methods. Start your own thread if that is what
you want to talk about.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>All,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>I will be happy to answer questions about
the burning abilities and tecniques of our stove and
combustor.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Kirk</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"
dir=ltr>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=crispinpigott@outlook.com
href="mailto:crispinpigott@outlook.com">Crispin Pemberton-Pigott</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">'Discussion of biomass cooking
stoves'</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 30, 2016 9:40 PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Stoves] stove test</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=WordSection1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">Dear
Kirk<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> With the support of
Aprovecho Research Center, I (actually we) have developed a very good, clean
burning TLUD-ND. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">I
think you have done exactly that. Good on you.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">There
is no misdirection at all here. You are past the verge of changing the stove’s
superior performance in order to get a better rating on an invalid metric. It
is that simple. Don’t get sucked into that trap. When you are getting results
as good as you are, there are new opportunities to go wrong.
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">The
only ‘misdirection’ has been supplied for years by test methods that guided
people to edit their stoves to meet spurious requirements that did not bear
directly on performance, or worse, actually penalised stoves for their
superior performance. A good example is attached.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">This
is not something new in the stove community. Here is a quote from the attached
Aprovecho document from 2003:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><I><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">“Why
was the good advice, by established experts in the field, represented in the
VITA International Standard test, the result of several well funded
international conferences, obscure in 2003? Both the Indian and Chinese
governments developed tests of their own widening the scope of PHU to include
power, rate of evaporation, time. Visser (2003) published a version of a water
boiling test based on efficiency and appropriate power for boiling and
simmering. What motivated this parallel activity? Why isn’t the VITA test in
more general use?”<o:p></o:p></SPAN></I></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">One
reason the VITA test was not more popular was it had several conceptual errors
and a few really poor metrics that gave mis-directing outputs. One is the
efficiency of simmering, another is the concept of specific fuel consumption
for simmering. Another was the idea of an ‘average efficiency’ meaning
an ‘average thermal efficiency’. I believe from my research that the specific
fuel consumption for simmering and the average efficiency were both introduced
by Baldwin in 1986 or so, before his book came out. Neither are acceptable
metrics.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">The
document refers to the VITA test the ‘international standard’ which is not
supported by the evidence. Three or four minor parties agreed to it and it was
never used by the major markets in India and China. Even Eindhoven University
didn’t use it and they were a party to drafting it. India pretty much adopted
the minority position taken by KK Prasad from Eindhoven and built that into
their 1991 test. The Chinese test from that era was very similar. India,
interestingly, produced a list of 28 standard sizes of cooking pot which is a
record, I believe!<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">The
long-forgotten organisation Bois de Feu had a clear understanding of these
issues and had a test method in 1982 that didn’t have these problems. They
treated the simmering phase very carefully (and differently). Prasad (and
Visser who was his student) developed multiple test methods over the years.
Piet Visser and I created one in Malawi in about 2007 which later evolved into
the ProBEC Test for heat transfer efficiency which is now a SeTAR SOP,
currently v1.05 (SeTAR is an independently managed continuation of the 13 year
long GIZ/ProBEC project). It doesn’t really predict performance, it gives a
real-time heat transfer efficiency report under varying conditions. It is very
easy to perform and it supports pot-swapping, similar to the Indian
protocol.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">So,
ladies and gentlemen, there are no Tier 4 stoves. That achievement will have
to wait for the development of appropriate, valid low power metrics and one
will need an equipment set capable of quantifying the
result.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">Kirk:
don’t be bamboozled. You are doing good work. Nothing is perfectly
correct. Independent investigation of truth is still
required.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">Best
wishes<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US">Crispin<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">All,</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">With the support of
Aprovecho Research Center, I (actually we) have developed a very good, clean
burning TLUD-ND. This is real and proven and no amount of
misdirection can change that. It will be at Aprovecho for stove
camp for all to examine, and I will be giving a presentation on how it
burns so clean.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Respectfully,</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Kirk</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Santa Rosa, CA.
USA</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV>
<P>
<HR>
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