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Tony and Adam and all,<br>
<br>
I reply regarding only one (very good) part of Tony's message:
<blockquote type="cite">Then train an army of well wishing
adventurers to deliver the designs to the source with standardised
induction, development (actually option selection) process and
train local constructors and knowledge specialists on basics of
burning and insulation to construct and repair. </blockquote>
This would be a way to rapidly multiply the impacts!!! Details to
be worked out, and MANY variations of arrangements for the
"adventurers" could be use. <br>
<br>
One variation already in place is when university students head to
other places for a month, summer, or semester. They would benefit
from some support by those who cannot leave their jobs or children.<br>
<br>
A great example is the student program at the University of Dayton,
called ETHOS (which shared its name with the ETHOS conference
group).<br>
<br>
And into the Peace Corps, or shorter-term PC-type efforts.<br>
<br>
And you do not need $30.5 million for this (but that amount would
not be turned away.)<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>
Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.drtlud.com">www.drtlud.com</a></pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/8/2016 5:43 PM, Tony Vovers
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAL+HB2T2t2k45+GUwqeiLYQLcsCfDC98tH9OGK1L6eXwycRi+A@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<p dir="ltr">I would add a specific clause to design and test
stove or kitchen systems that can be locally adapted and
constructed based on users needs with local materials, sand,
straw, clay etc at low to no cost, without the need for
specialised manufacturing of any kind. Focusing on user friendly
features to help the cook/family be efficient and safe.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Multi pot, hot water, continuous use, start and stop,
fuel drying, chimney or flue for exhaust, simmering and food
warming, charcoal option, char creation, easy maintain and
clean, easy repair.<br>
Primary focus on users needs, fuel management, add the science
later for efficiency, health and safety and testing.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Then train an army of well wishing adventurers to
deliver the designs to the source with standardised induction,
development (actually option selection) process and train local
constructors and knowledge specialists on basics of burning and
insulation to construct and repair. <br>
<br>
</p>
<p dir="ltr">Tony Vovers</p>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 7 Nov 2016 13:31, "Frank Shields"
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:franke@cruzio.com">franke@cruzio.com</a>>
wrote:<br type="attribution">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">Dear Tom, Crispin,
Stovers,
<div><br>
<div>There is available 30.5 million dollars thats going
to be spent by one University to determine if lives
will be saved if biomass burners switched over to LPD
- an I reading that correctly? So I ask; What would I
do with the 30.5 million dollars?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>1) Map out Globally where the poorest of the poor
live. People so poor they cannot afford LPG. People
the 30.5 funds are ignoring and leaving behind. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>2) List, collect and categorize the fuels they have
available and inventory the amount. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>3) Pick several types of stoves that represent the
ones available (rocket, TLUD, rice and dung etc) and
determine the fuel characteristics that are most
important in the stove operation. </div>
<div>Moisture, size and shape of particles, carbon
density, bulk density, Volatile fraction at 450c, ash
etc. etc. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>4) Assay the fuels collected in number (2) for the
important parameters found in (3). </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>5) Match the available solid biomass fuels to a
list of appropriate stoves on the market. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>6) Set up labs and certification program.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>7) List of approved methods for the labs to use in
testing. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>8) Once the above is completed we can then take the
stoves matched with the appropriate fuels and Cook
Food. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>9) Then is the time to test air quality.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Wondering what others would do if they got the 30.5
million dollars and wanted to make a difference??</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Frank</div>
<div>Frank Shields</div>
<div>Gabilan Laboratory</div>
<div>Keith Day Company</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On Nov 6, 2016, at 10:00 AM, Tom Miles <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:tmiles@trmiles.com"
target="_blank">tmiles@trmiles.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-interchange-newline">
<div>
<div class="m_2988350279776289955WordSection1"
style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:18px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The
Global Alliance for Chronic Disease
(CACD), which is coordinating the study,
appears to be looking at LPG as an
alternative to wood and not in combination
with wood as discussed in the “context”
thread. There is no mention of protocols
or comparisons among fuels. What is being
used to represent “wood” smoke?<span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-contributes-global-effort-prevent-manage-lung-diseases"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">https://www.nih.gov/news-<wbr>events/news-releases/nih-<wbr>contributes-global-effort-<wbr>prevent-manage-lung-diseases</a></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The
study appears to be the result of a 2015
funding opportunity announcement and is a
joint project of NIH, the Gates
Foundation, the Global Alliance for Clean
Cookstoves (GACC), and the Global Alliance
for Chronic Diseases (GACD). If I have the
correct announcement LPG wasn’t specified
in the original solicitation. Second hand
cigarette smoke was. The solicitation was
directed only to universities. Emory
University will conduct the study.<span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://grants.nih.gov/grants/guide/rfa-files/RFA-HL-16-012.html"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">http://grants.nih.gov/grants/<wbr>guide/rfa-files/RFA-HL-16-012.<wbr>html</a><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span> </span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Are
there studies which address the use of
multiple fuels and the impact of improved
cook stoves?<span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Tom</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
name="m_2988350279776289955__MailEndCompose"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></a></div>
<span></span>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><b><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span>Stoves
[<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.<wbr>bioenergylists.org</a>]<span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf
Of<span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Traveller<br>
<b>Sent:</b><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span>Saturday,
November 05, 2016 4:01 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:adam@instove.org"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline"
target="_blank">adam@instove.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span>Discussion
of biomass cooking stoves <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.<wbr>org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span>SPAM:
Re: [Stoves] NIH and Gates
Foundation-Funded Research to Measure
Health Benefits of Clean Cookstoves</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">Adam, list: </div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in
12pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">There's more to this,
going back to 21 September 2010 when HRC
announced GACC at CGI and a press
release announcing US support for clean
cookstoves. I will send it to you and
Tom separately in case you are
interested. I have excerpted key parts
below.<span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></p>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">NIH and CDC have
spent some $42 m on cookstoves and
health as of last FY; probably another
$5m this FY just ended in Sept. See <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/ps/2015/09/247240.htm"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">The
United States' Commitment to the
Global Alliance for Clean
Cookstoves: Year Five Progress
Report</a>.</div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">I don't think new
woodstove designs or dissemination
have anything to do with that research
so far or the new research proposed,
which is about<span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span><i>LPG
users. </i></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">As GACC notes, it is
to </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">"monitor the stove
use and exposure to household air
pollution of participating households
in India, Rwanda, Guatemala, and Peru.
The study will assess health outcomes,
including birth weight, growth, and
respiratory infections in children and
respiratory function, blood pressure,
and inflammation in adults."</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><br>
Of course.</div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">This is parasitic
research, It is to make a health case
for LPG because the health case
against solid fuels has already been
cooked up and blared on all media all
over. This Community of Practice is
irrelevant for this research, I am
afraid. </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">As for the Gateses,
the money will probably go to the
super-human beings at IHME who dish
out deaths by assumptions every six
months now, it seems. IHME has loads
of Gates money, and of course they
have WHO and the media lapping at
their hands and feet. Everybody seems
to be convinced by cite-o-logy. </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">I wouldn't mind this
if users did not want LPG and had to
be persuaded. Which - as far as I can
tell - is NOT the case. <br>
<br>
Yes, LPG emissions can have PM2.5. And
yes, food emissions may also have
PM2.5. Under the assumption that all
PM2.5 are equally toxic, of course
this global health folks will want to
poke their noses in "participating
households". They will enjoy the
smells, I can guarantee. </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">Remember, only USAID
can put money in other countries for
stove research and dissemination. And
even there its hands are tied on
procurement. </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">Nikhil</div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in 0in
12pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><br>
Excerpts from Sept 21, 2010 press
release: </p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><b><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">"Department
of Health and Human Services
(HHS)</span></b></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><b><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">-National
Institutes of Health (NIH) –$24.7
million</span></b></div>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt
119.25pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Wingdings"><span>§<span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times
New Roman'"><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">NIH will commit
about $24.7 million over five years to
support ongoing research and research
training projects, as well as new
efforts to develop improved measuring
devices, expand epidemiologic studies
and conduct clinical trials. Ongoing
projects include studies on the
cookstove-related effects on pulmonary
and cardiac diseases, the relationship
between indoor air pollution and
low-birth weight, and studies on the
most effective ways to introduce and
educate users on safety and the proper
use of cookstoves. Training programs
help prepare scientists in low- and
middle-income countries to engage in
related research and evaluation
activities.</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt
119.25pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Wingdings"><span>§<span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times
New Roman'"><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">NIH will also
lead and co-sponsor an international
state-of-science cookstoves conference
in late Spring 2011. The Office of
Global Health Affairs, within HHS’
Office of the Secretary, will contribute
$100,000 to support this conference.</span></div>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in
0in
12pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">-<b>Centers
for Disease Control (CDC) – $1
million</b></span></p>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">As a
founding member the CDC is
committing to working closely with
Alliance members and the global
community to:</span></div>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt
119.25pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Wingdings"><span>§<span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times
New Roman'"><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">Demonstrate the
health benefits of implementing clean
cookstove programs</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt
119.25pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Wingdings"><span>§<span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times
New Roman'"><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">Better
understand the relationship between
human exposures and health outcomes</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt
119.25pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Wingdings"><span>§<span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times
New Roman'"><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">Integrate
cookstove implementation with other
public health programs</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt
119.25pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Wingdings"><span>§<span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times
New Roman'"><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">Evaluate
cookstove program implementation</span></div>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><b><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">OVERVIEW</span></b></div>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt
119.25pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Wingdings"><span>§<span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times
New Roman'"><span
class="m_2988350279776289955Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><b><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">Nearly 2
million premature deaths every year</span></b></div>
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<blockquote
style="margin-left:30pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><b><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">............</span></b></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><b><span
style="font-size:9.5pt">----------</span></b>----</div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"> </div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif">On Sat, Nov 5, 2016
at 2:35 PM, <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:adam@instove.org"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline"
target="_blank">adam@instove.org</a>>
wrote:</div>
<blockquote style="border-style:none
none none
solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1pt;padding:0in
0in 0in
6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">I
have written to the Director
of the NIH about this study,
and have not heard back.
Sometimes going straight to
the top works, but not this
time, apparently. </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">What
I would like to know is
whether anyone in this
community of practice was part
of the discussions around this
research. At the price tag,
this is the single largest
cookstove study that I've ever
heard of. Anyone know of a
larger one? </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Anyone
know which stove models are
going to be studied? </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Anyone
know how the countries were
selected (and Africa was
somehow missed)? </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Is
there any clarity on this? I
feel pretty blindsided. I just
spoke with a Gates Senior
Program officer who retired
last month. She reaffirmed
what I'd heard before: "No
way" that Gates can fund
cookstoves. Yet this
week...this. </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">How
did this happen? When will
details come out? </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Anyone
have any insights? Would love
to be more informed, but
feeling pretty blindsided now.
Echoing Nikhil's
disappointment if this
historically-well-funded study
by the largest US Foundation
turns out to be a paean to
LPG. </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Would
prefer an LPG swan song (re:
Nikhil's "wild goose chase").</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Adam</span></div>
</div>
<blockquote
id="m_2988350279776289955gmail-m_-4640458746541906493m_196466424099529049replyBlockquote"
style="border-style:none none none
solid;border-left-color:blue;border-left-width:1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
6pt;margin-left:6pt;margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt" type="cite">
<div
id="m_2988350279776289955gmail-m_-4640458746541906493m_196466424099529049wmQuoteWrapper">
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">--------
Original Message --------<br>
Subject: Re: [Stoves] NIH
and Gates Foundation-Funded
Research to<br>
Measure Health Benefits of
Clean Cookstoves</span></div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0in 0in
12pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">From:
Traveller <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:miata98@gmail.com"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline"
target="_blank">miata98@gmail.com</a>><br>
Date: Fri, November 04,
2016 5:15 pm<br>
To: Discussion of
biomass cooking stoves<br>
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline"
target="_blank">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.<wbr>org</a>></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Tom: </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">This is to cook
White House South
Lawn meals for the
researchers of
"links" and
"associations" that
WHO and GACC can
later call
"causes". <br>
<br>
It is a
"multi-country trial
to investigate the
correlation between
home use of clean
cookstoves using
liquefied petroleum
gas and its
measurable health
benefits,
particularly for
women and children."<br>
<br>
Duh!! Why? Don't
most cooks want to
switch to LPG? This
isn't like measuring
- if at all possible
- "health benefits"
- whatever they may
be - of newfangled
biomass or coal
stoves, and then
marketing them for
the health benefits.
If users are going
to switch to LPG or
electricity anyway,
I suppose NIH could
get into the health
damage due to LPG
and electricity.
After all, the
Empire Promotion
Agency has declared
that GHGs "endanger"
American public's
health. <br>
<br>
Coming to think of
it, maybe this is an
ideological response
to the anti-carbon
nuts who claim LPG
is to be avoided as
a "fossil fuel" and
"renewable biomass"
be pursued
exclusively, no
matter its health
and environmental
effects (land, water
and labor use, plus
reliance on
livestock for
manure)? </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Only in America.
How amusing and
sad. </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">This
is a - what? Wild
goose chase? Going up
alleys known to be
blind? </span></div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Or confirming the
obvious, but
subjecting the
control group to
continue to suffer
the health damage? <br>
<br>
What are they going
to do with the LPG
option offered to
users who
participate in the
study? Take the
cylinders and stoves
back? </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Why even bother,
since Kirk Smith
says, LPG is "</span><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif">the fuel that could
save millions of
lives every year. •
By definition!</span><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">" (<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://ehsdiv.sph.berkeley.edu/krsmith/Presentations/2016/SRU%20Oct%2016%20used.pdf"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">Environmental
Health in
India:What are the
issues and what is
India doing about
it?</a> Sri
Ramachandra
University, Chennai
October 6, 2016.)</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">All I can say is
that the glory of
Gates in the Global
Burden of Disease -
Killing by
Assumption - is
enhanced by the US
government. Keeps
Washington (DC and
State) busy. </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Nikhil</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> </span></div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"><br clear="all">
</span></div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div
style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New
Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:9.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif"><br>
------- </span><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"></span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote
style="border-style:none
none none
solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1pt;padding:0in
0in 0in
6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"
type="cite">
<div
style="margin:0in
0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New
Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"><br>
<br>
------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>----------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Mon, 31
Oct 2016
11:14:30 -0700<br>
From: "Tom
Miles" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:tmiles@trmiles.com"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline"
target="_blank">tmiles@trmiles.com</a>><br>
To:
"'Discussion
of biomass
cooking
stoves'"<br>
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline"
target="_blank">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.<wbr>org</a>><br>
Subject:
[Stoves] NIH
and Gates
Foundation-Funded
Research to
Measure<br>
Health
Benefits of
Clean
Cookstoves<br>
Message-ID:
<018f01d233a2$a13661e0$<wbr>e3a325a0$@<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://trmiles.com/"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline"
target="_blank">trmiles.com</a>><br>
Content-Type:
text/plain;
charset="us-ascii"<br>
<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://cleancookstoves.org/about/news/10-25-2016-nih-and-gates-foundation-funded-research-to-measure-health-benefits-of-clean-cookstoves.html"
style="color:purple;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">http://cleancookstoves.org/<wbr>about/news/10-25-2016-nih-and-<wbr>gates-foundation-fu<br>
nded-research-to-measure-<wbr>health-benefits-of-clean-<wbr>cookstoves.html</a><br>
<br>
- </span></div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0in 0in
0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New
Roman',serif;text-align:center"
align="center"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">
<hr align="center" size="3"
width="100%"></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0in 0in
12pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times
New Roman',serif"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
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<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
Stoves mailing list
to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/">http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</a>
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