<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Dear all,<br>
<br>
That is a very informative link. Thank you Inglore!!<br>
<br>
1. I like the name "upside down fire". Descriptive and not
confusing. Not trying to slip in the gasification terminlogy of
TLUD. It is not intened to be a "gasifier."<br>
<br>
2. The postings seem to begin in 2009. So this is not very
"historical" and the writer had some earlier experience. <br>
<br>
3. I have tried such a fire in my home's fireplace, and I liked
it. BUT this blog taught me some things:<br>
<br>
A. <b><u>Stack the large wood TIGHTLY. </u></b> Try to NOT let the
embers fall to the bottom. <br>
B. Also comments about crinkling the paper and about getting the
whole fire started.<br>
<br>
4. For our STOVES Listserv, there is no mention of trying to do
cooking or trying to assist impoverished people. Nevertheless,
this is still useful information and is appropriate for these
discussions.<br>
<br>
Repeating my earlier message, Anyone,
<br>
<br>
Please do some searching about what Crispin describes below. And
please share with the Stoves Listserv.
<br>
<br>
I hope that someone decides to really get into the topic of "upside
down fires".<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>
Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.drtlud.com">www.drtlud.com</a></pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/16/2016 4:24 PM, Ingelore Kahrens
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:91881b5a-74a3-9fe0-fad9-444696f48348@onlinehome.de"
type="cite">Hi everyone,
<br>
<br>
I found some well-illustrated instructions.
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://fourhourworkweek.com/2009/02/02/how-to-build-an-upside-down-fire/">http://fourhourworkweek.com/2009/02/02/how-to-build-an-upside-down-fire/</a>
<br>
<br>
I loved building fires when I was a girl scout - and still do
today. And IŽll try this method as soon as possible.
<br>
<br>
Ingelore
<br>
<br>
<br>
Am 16.11.2016 um 23:10 schrieb Paul Anderson:
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Anyone,
<br>
<br>
Please do some searching about what Crispin describes below.
And please share with the Stoves Listserv.
<br>
<br>
Paul
<br>
<br>
Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
<br>
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>
<br>
Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
<br>
Website: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.drtlud.com">www.drtlud.com</a>
<br>
<br>
On 11/15/2016 11:17 PM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott wrote:
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Dear Neil
<br>
<br>
When I was in Scouts we always made the main fires in the
manner described.
<br>
I didn't see another method used so it must have been around
for a while.
<br>
<br>
The oldest methods described for lighting a smokeless fire
also describe a
<br>
top lit fire. This was a quasi-military thing as cooking
without smoke was
<br>
important. It is in the books on "Indian" fire building
methods going back
<br>
yonks.
<br>
<br>
I was not aware that everyone as not aware this is how to do
it.
<br>
<br>
Regards
<br>
Crispin
<br>
<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----
<br>
From: Stoves [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org">mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>]
On Behalf Of
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:neiltm@uwclub.net">neiltm@uwclub.net</a>
<br>
Sent: 16-Nov-16 05:40
<br>
To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org"><stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org></a>
<br>
Subject: Re: [Stoves] Accidental TLUD technique discovery
<br>
<br>
Crispin, I'm amazed by your scouting campfire experience, it
bears
<br>
absolutely no relation to mine, where in both the troops I was
in at
<br>
different times the fires whether for cooking or the sing song
camp evening
<br>
fire were completely conventional bottom lit, the latter
sometimes in a
<br>
tepee construction. What you are describing, but probably on
a larger
<br>
scale, seems to be what Paal Wendelbo described and that
inspired him. It
<br>
might be interesting to try to discover if old scouting
literature describes
<br>
making fires this way. Our cooking was in large oval cast
iron 'dixies'
<br>
placed on top of sticks aligned in the direction of the wind
hopefully. The
<br>
most sophisticated thing we did was to roast large joints of
pork, from
<br>
breakfast time to be ready at lunch time where a roasting tin
with the joint
<br>
was placed on a bed of embers, a galvanised bath tub inverted
over the whole
<br>
and sealed with ash and a fire from a separate pit brought
over and placed
<br>
around the windward side and on top.
<br>
Guaging the degree of cooking was by removing a pole from
the corner of the
<br>
cook house shelter, placing the metal tip on the top of the
bathtub and the
<br>
wooden end in an ear! After 4 years of observing and helping
in this
<br>
process you became sufficiently competent to take charge of
it. We were
<br>
allowed half an hour leeway to bring the pork to the table,
pork properly
<br>
cooked was more important than punctuality!
<br>
<br>
So was the TLUD/CD fire common knowledge in Britain/Europe? I
never came
<br>
across it in the late 50s and sixties, or since. Our
scoutmaster was an ex
<br>
navy man, perhaps if he had been army? There's some unwritten
history here
<br>
surely?
<br>
<br>
But I came across this through the second hit on a search for
'scout camp
<br>
fire instructions':
<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.rei.com/learn/expert-advice/campfire-basics.html">https://www.rei.com/learn/expert-advice/campfire-basics.html</a>
<br>
<br>
They call it the 'Upside down (pyramid)' (the fire being
'upside down', not
<br>
the pyramid!
<br>
<br>
The girl guides also have it, but they don't really understand
it, unless
<br>
yours had tinder at the bottom as well?:
<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://gscm.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/07-1137MasterOfTheCampfire.pdf">http://gscm.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/07-1137MasterOfTheCampfire.pdf</a>
<br>
<br>
"You can use several types of fire styl
<br>
es for a campfire. The PYRAMID starts
<br>
with a bottom layer of 4-6 inch diameter logs. Add subsequent
layers of
<br>
smaller shorter logs. Fill the center with tinder and kindling
and light the
<br>
fire on a small platform of sticks near the top. As it burns,
the coals fall
<br>
in to the middle, helping the fire burn downward."
<br>
<br>
wikihow.com don't know it
<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://scoutingmagazine.org/2016/02/how-to-build-the-best-campfire/">http://scoutingmagazine.org/2016/02/how-to-build-the-best-campfire/</a>
<br>
<br>
don't list it
<br>
<br>
It seems patchy, but I'm wondering if it simply became largely
forgotten in
<br>
my day and has been revived a bit in more recent times? It
always amazes me
<br>
what my parents generation didn't seem to know.
<br>
<br>
Best wishes, Neil Taylor
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________
<br>
Stoves mailing list
<br>
<br>
to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
<br>
<br>
to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
<br>
<br>
for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our
web site:
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/">http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</a>
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________
<br>
Stoves mailing list
<br>
<br>
to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
<br>
<br>
to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
<br>
<br>
for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our
web site:
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/">http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</a>
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________
<br>
Stoves mailing list
<br>
<br>
to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org">stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
<br>
<br>
to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org">http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org</a>
<br>
<br>
for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web
site:
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/">http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/</a>
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>