<div dir="ltr">Paul<div><br></div><div>We worked on solar/biomass heat storage stoves about 25 years ago. You must protect the heat storage medium from the flame. We were using evacuated tube collectors that raised superheated steam that circulated through the heat storage medium. Worked really well but was very expensive.</div><div><br></div><div>The ideal system is to use heat pipes to take the heat from the flame zone and store in the phase change material. Although this adds to the cost it means you phase change material will have a long lifetime.</div><div><br></div><div>Regards</div><div>Stephen</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 5, 2017 at 4:14 AM, Paul Anderson <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu" target="_blank">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Ron and all,<br>
<br>
I am studying the limited info about the Sun Bucket, and finding
enough to agree that it could well be compatible with TLUD stoves
(and to a lesser extent with other biomass stove-types.). So it is
not "off-topic" if, as Ron says, it can relate to biomass stoves.<br>
<br>
I doubt that it is only $50 if including a 1.5 meter solar dish.<br>
<br>
I will report back after I have direct contact with the company.<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<pre class="m_8618676839224573027moz-signature" cols="72">Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Email: <a class="m_8618676839224573027moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu" target="_blank">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>
Skype: paultlud Phone: <a href="tel:(309)%20452-7072" value="+13094527072" target="_blank">+1-309-452-7072</a>
Website: <a class="m_8618676839224573027moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.drtlud.com" target="_blank">www.drtlud.com</a></pre><div><div class="h5">
<div class="m_8618676839224573027moz-cite-prefix">On 1/3/2017 7:30 PM, Ronal W. Larson
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>David and list - and cc some solar cooking friends</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>Congratulations
on this modification of the usual solar cooker. And on the two
awards that Sun Buckets has already won.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>It
might seem you are on the wrong list - as we get little traffic
re solar cookers - and our “biomass” address would suggest this
is normally be the wrong place. But I see three connections
(that I have mentioned recently to the ccs), that make this
entirely appropriate for out stove list.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>a).
There could be reasons to employ the same storage concept at a
family (maybe neighborhood) level with any form of biomass
stove. I think it would fit especially well with TLUD stoves -
as they could be designed at a large (one full day of cooking)
size - and one day’s cooking could be much less time consuming
than at present. No solar involvement at all in approach a).</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>b).
There could be good reason for option a) (such as very high
fuel costs) to also want to couple a fully biomass approach with
(zero fuel cost ) solar. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>c).
Every solar option needs a backup - and biomass is the usual
choice (except in the USA).</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>The
backup need not make charcoal - but the solar cookers can never
be carbon negative; TLUDs can make that happen. Which won’t
happen normally with a liquid (LPG) etc.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>So
I’d like to continue this dialog with anyone interested.
Because of all the option a), b), c) possibilities, this
dialog could remain on this list. I suggest we stay away from
the solar-only topic you brought to us. And we can leave this
list if a few think it is detracting from our biomass stove
dialog.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>I
was employed at what is now NREL in Golden Colorado and have
several friends with extensive experience in high temperature
thermal storage (even little myself). I’ve been a member of SCI
on and off.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>My
friend Dr. Salih Hamadto (in Khartoum Sudan) has sold many
concentrators of the Scheffler variety - which I think might end
up being a preferred approach - instead of paraboloids. All
the ccs know about biochar - which I think has a much more
natural fit with your nice idea than our rocket enthusiasts.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Ron</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<br>
<div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On Jan 3, 2017, at 12:51 PM, David Stein <<a href="mailto:ambwat@gmail.com" target="_blank">ambwat@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="m_8618676839224573027Apple-interchange-newline">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">D<font size="2">ear All,</font></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif""><font size="2"><br>
</font></span></p>
<font size="2">
</font>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2"><span style="line-height:115%;font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">I am a newcomer to the Stoves list but I’ve
spent some
time in the household energy sector in developing
Vanuatu which is where I met
Nikhil.</span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2"><span style="line-height:115%;font-family:"arial","sans-serif""><br>
</span></font></p>
<font size="2">
</font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">I am fascinated by solar cooking these
days.<span> </span>There are many
potential socio-economic and
environmental benefits of solar cooking and they are
all very seductive.<span> </span>Just
thinking about fuel-free and
emission-free cooking is intoxicating.</span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif""><br>
</span></font></p>
<font size="2">
</font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">However, it seems that it is difficult to
achieve the potential benefits of solar cooking
(especially in the developing
world) largely because those that dwell in hot
climates (which is where much of
the developing world seems to be located) have
developed lifestyles that
minimize exposure to the sun whereas most methods of
solar cooking require the
cook to be out in the sun, often at times of the day
that aren’t typical
cooking times.<span> </span>These facts
make the
difficult task of changing the cooking habits of
cooks even more challenging.</span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif""><br>
</span></font></p>
<font size="2">
</font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">But it appears as though the Sun Bucket </span><a href="http://www.sunbuckets.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">http://www.sunbuckets.com/</span></a><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif""><span> </span>“cracks all of these nuts.”<span> </span>This amazing innovation is
“charged” with the
heat of sunshine and the heat is stored in a “sun
bucket” (phase change
“”battery”) where it can be used when (like in the
evening or early morning)
and where (like inside a kitchen) it is needed.<span>
</span>It cooks as hot as cooking on fire and
existing cooking pots and pans
can be used so there is minimal need for changes in
cooking behavior.<span> </span>It also
seems very affordable.<span> </span>I
guess it’s what they call transformational. <br>
</span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif""><br>
</span></font></p>
<font size="2">
</font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">It looks as though a Sun Bucket should be a
part of every integrated coking scheme (solar
cooking when it's sunny, using an
Improved Cook Stove when it's not, and maybe using a
retained heat cooker with
both) everywhere the sun shines in the developing
world.<span> </span>I can hardly wait for
the Sun Bucket to be
unleashed to the world-wide market of cooks that
could really use them.</span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif""><br>
</span></font></p>
<font size="2">
</font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">Best wishes for the coming year.</span></font></p>
<font size="2">
</font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal"><font size="2"><span style="font-family:"arial","sans-serif"">David Stein</span></font></p>
</div>
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