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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=FR link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dear Ron,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thank you for your answer.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>First, I wanted to react to your comments in your last email. I agree with you, there are a lot of dedicated and decent professionals who worked hard to make a difference with cookstoves, who used the WBT and thought it was a good protocol.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I am not trying to judge people, or tell where there was crookedness and manipulations.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The WBT was basically the go-to protocol during years, because ... just because. It was there, so it’s only normal people used it and worked with it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>And now that we have some serious scientific proof, deciding to not look at it, deciding to look away, would be something different entirely. Now that we know, there’s no looking away.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>So that’s why we need to focus on facts, and discuss this further, and go where discussion has not been yet.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« Your statement that ISO is a black box answers many of the questions below. It is imperative that you learn how ISO works. Your best route would seem to be AFNOR - since you are French. I work only through ANSI - not ISO. »</i></b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I fully understood that, as Nikhil said in his last email, the ISO process is an intergovernmental one. There is a frame, and not every individual can join when he/she decides. That is perfectly fine. But I believe ISO committees are made to develop standards, to normalize. Based on scientific evidence that already exists. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t believe the ISO is meant to be the place where R&D happens. That’s what I was replying to Ranyee: « We should not wait. The R&D and the discussion on development of protocols have to also take place outside of the TC 285. »<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Telling me to temper my critiques and join the ISO if I want to discuss and develop protocols is a cop-out.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>On the other end, this List is one of the good places to foster R&D.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Now the discussion is becoming interesting. We go nowhere if our discussions are only: « I think the WBT should be discarded! » « No! I think it is valuable! »<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>We need to discuss why, present scientific arguments and counter-arguments, and make progress together.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« « The WBT IS valuable »</i></b><i><o:p></o:p></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>« Can you explain what is valuable about the WBT? »<o:p></o:p></span></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« I speak selfishly when I note that TLUDs shine at the WBT. I suspect some don’t like the WBT because their favorite technology doesn’t shine. By shine and value I mean that the WBT is behind most of the tier rankings - which long ago were accepted unanimously as the right way to proceed with stove improvement at this time. To me the WBT is all about improvement. If you can’t measure something, it won’t be improved. I disagree with those especially who say that there is no proven connection between measured CO and PM values in the lab and in the field. If not obtained with today’s WBT, what test is to be preferred? (answer in next question.) »</i></b><i><o:p></o:p></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Then, if I understand well your answers, you say that the WBT is valuable because:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l8 level1 lfo22'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>the TLUD shine at it<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l8 level1 lfo22'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>it has tier rankings, who are the right way to proceed with stove improvement<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>What if tier rankings are not scientifically valid?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Lombardi and al. say in their paper of February 2017: <i>« An important consequence of these considerations is that the Tier of Performance of a given stove, assigned based on the results from WBT or similar protocols, may result in a not reliable performance indicator for technology selection. »<o:p></o:p></i></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a href="http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096195341730065X">http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096195341730065X</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« If you can’t measure something, it won’t be improved »<o:p></o:p></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Of course, that’s why we need testing, that’s why we need protocols. There are alternative testing protocols that do measure. They measure more accurately than the WBT does.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>« </span><b><i>I suspect some don’t like the WBT because their favorite technology doesn’t shine. »<o:p></o:p></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Either you insinuate too much, or you insinuate not enough. Go ahead, let’s speak frankly on all subjects, let’s make some progress.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Who does not like the WBT because their technology doesn’t shine?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>What are these technologies, what were the test results?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« The documents I found at your above cite were from the South African SETAR. I stopped reading when I read this sentence in the last of the four there: “A cooking session using a <o:p></o:p></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>system with a heat flux rate of 2 W/cm 2 will boil 5 liters of water in under 25 minutes.” » </i></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Why not read until the end? It’s not a long document. How can we discuss something if you are not even ready to read fully what is being discussed? No, it is not a boiling test. The water is not boiled, since it has been proved it was rendering the test results false. The water is the medium used to measure heat transferred to the pot.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>It is not about performing a cooking task (boiling water), falsely considered universal, and comparing (or being in fact unable to compare) how stoves fare doing that task. It is about understanding the power delivered by the stove.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Please read the February paper from Lombardi and al. which explains well how different the protocols are.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>It also tells why the HTP and WHT are vastly superior to the WBT.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The CSI is even better, because of the added element of contextuality.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>You listed the experts that are, according to you, currently, as of now September 2017, still advocating continued use of the WBT:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Jim Jetter<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Ranyee Chiang<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>John Mitchell<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Tami Bond<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Michael Johnson<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Kirk Smith<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Tom Miles<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Andrew Heggie<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l11 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dean Still<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Ranyee Chiang said we were beyond the WBT.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I have talked with Jim Jetter and he did not come accross to me as, currently, a strong supporter of the WBT anymore.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I talked to Tami Bond, and she said that the WBT had things to be criticized, and that we needed to move forward, and not look backward (the WBT). I don’t think she strongly supports the WBT.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I talked to Kirk Smith in Delhi, and he didn’t seem to have an opinion, neither for nor against the WBT.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dean Still is strongly supporting the WBT and its use.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>So I have a feeling this leaves only a handful of people.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Of course, what we need is for this people to express publicly what they think about the WBT. And better, why.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Can the above-mentioned persons react?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« If it is not yet clear, I am claiming you are in a small minority of “experts”. »<o:p></o:p></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I am no expert, I never claimed to be. I am not fond of the expression. Who establishes who is an expert? On what basis? Anyone is entitled to his/her own opinion, and can express it, no need to be an expert.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I don’t think I am in a minority, I think your claim is incorrect. It is a claim that has often been made, to try to minimize the fact that there are a lot of people tired of the WBT. Usually, the claim was that Crispin was alone.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Well Crispin is the only one who is outspoken. Not the only one unhappy with the WBT.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>From my exchanges prior and since the advocacy initiative, there is a far larger number of people who are not happy with the WBT than people thinking we should still be using it. Certainly far larger than the list above.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Many people from the stove sector, from various countries and organizations, senior professionals, not new comers, have expressed to me their support to the initiative. I am not sharing their names, since most of these people have not expressed the desire to be quoted publicly. They are busy in day-to-day work, they are involved in partnerships, they are applying to funding. They do not wish to enter a heated and public debate.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>« What is so unique about the WBT that cannot be done by the CSI nor HTP?</span></i><i><o:p></o:p></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>All “the experts” I trust are advocating continued use of the WBT. »</i></b><i><o:p></o:p></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>You are not answering the question. Some « experts » say we should use the WBT. Other people say the contrary, offer alternatives. The « experts » do not look at critiques. They do not look at the alternatives. They keep advocating continued use of the WBT.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>This is unscientific. They overlook the critiques, they overlook the alternatives, they keep using a much criticized method while not looking on the sides.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>What is so unique about the WBT that cannot be done by the CSI nor HTP?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>How you compared the CSI and HTP in your post makes me think actually, all that is done by a WBT can be done by the CSI and HTP.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« My concern was about making char and using the “denominator” equation - which seems to be the main dispute which I have been having for years with Crispin. And also you?? »<o:p></o:p></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I don’t have an opinion on the denominator equation. I was convinced by Tami and Crispin’s answers previously on the subject.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>« </span></i><b><i>[RWL7: Apologies if I didn’t respond, but I do know that I contacted many of the principal authors (and I think Riva) and think I might have reported. I am pretty sure that the basic WBT approach was not in doubt with them. »<o:p></o:p></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I don’t remember that you reported on the Stove List that you had contacted the authors. When was it ?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I have to fully disagree here: the WBT protocol is very much in doubt with Riva and Lombardi! It is the whole point of their articles.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>These are the issues with the WBT, listed in their February article:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>« Some of WBT critical issues remain unsolved. In particular, the main weakness of the WBT concerns its real-life relevance. As a matter of fact, the protocol prescribes to test the stove for a fixed combination of burn sequence (high-power and low-power) and pot dimensions. This limits the test relevance to just that particular setting: when any variation of these parameters e which deeply affect the system performance e is introduced, results may significantly differ. Criticism about WBT concerns also the repeatability of the protocol, with a number of researchers claiming that it would need to be reviewed in terms of accuracy. The WBT is a controlled laboratory test, thus supposed to be characterized by good repeatability and to be effective in comparing different stove designs. Nevertheless, the choice to bring the water to the boil preventing the use of the lid e that is made in order to better approximate a typical cooking task e is not functional to this purpose. As a matter of fact, uncertainties related to temperature reading and vaporisation in the boiling region lead to high variability between test replicates. In order to improve the reliability and replicability of the tests, the latest version of the protocol includes the section “Changes to Testing Conditions to Improve Repeatability”, which refers to different fuels and pot characteristics. However, eventual changes involving other parameters (pot insulation and maximum water temperature), which deeply affect test variability, are not mentioned. Such problems give evidence of an unsolved conflict between the declared purpose of the WBT (viz. to be a design-phase test, not intended to be representative of real-use performance), and a general tendency to use the results form WBT as a significant means to select the most appropriate cooking stove for a given context. A lot of debate has been made around formulation of metrics, primarily on thermal efficiency (Table C3), which is often interpreted as the most immediate and distinctive stove performance parameter. Studies from Bailis et al. highlighted how relying on WBT thermal efficiency outputs, regardless of the relative importance of high and low power cooking tasks among the target population, can lead to misleading interpretations. Furthermore, Zhang et al. and Jetter et al. questioned the scientific meaningfulness of thermal efficiency at simmering. Indeed, this phase is characterised by highly variable steam production, which represents a heat loss in the energy balance but positively contributes to the efficiency value in the actual formulation of thermal efficiency. Finally, some unsolved issues concerning statistical significance of data are worth mentioning. WBT 4.2.3 includes “Statistic Lessons for Performance Testing”. The appendix specifies that the minimum number of test replicates for each model of stove should be three, although it is reported that this number of replicates is not necessarily sufficient to determine a stove performance within a certain confidence interval. Nevertheless, Wang et al. noticed how a great majority of published studies are performed using a number of replicates that is equal or less than three, perhaps due to a misinterpretation of the Appendix message as “only three tests are needed”, regardless of variability and confidence interval. Wang et al. investigated this topic using a simplified version of the WBT 3.0 and demonstrated that more than 5 replicates are likely to be required to avoid impractically large 95% confidence intervals and that even more replicates may be required to demonstrate a statistically significant difference in performance between two or more stoves. »<o:p></o:p></span></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>« do you have an answer to the questions about the rationale of some calculations raised by Zhang et al.?</span></i><i><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>[RWL: Give me more to go on. »</i></b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>There is a lot on that, please read:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo25'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>·<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Key differences of performance test protocols for household biomass cookstoves. Twenty-Second Domestic Use of Energy, IEEE 2014:1–11.<br><a href="http://energyuse.org.za/document-archive/">http://energyuse.org.za/document-archive/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>To access the file, select DUE [Domestic Use of energy COnference]. Select DUE 2014. Select PROCEEDINGS. Select paper by Zhang etal (PDFs arranged alphabetically).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« [RWL: Yes I can support the use of just three tests - if they are “relatively” close together in all tier statistics. If one test if vastly different than the other two, then additional testing should take place. The main reason for accepting three is trying to keep costs low. I gather that one can make some useful statistical importance with just two tests. »</i></b><i><o:p></o:p></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Studies have proven you wrong. This is statiscally inaccurate.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>In your answers to my 3 questions, you said the uncertainties are acceptable. I felt you said the WBT issues are acceptable.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>We are talking about critical issues here, not something that can be brushed off so easily.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« [RWL: Where do I go read that? (It is getting too late to find, read, and report back). This one looks important. »</i></b><br><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Please ask Crispin about it. I don’t think it is public.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><i>« </i></span><b><i>[RWL: Please correct me if wrong, but I don’t believe this test is at all applicable to cook stoves; it may or may not have some value for cook stoves - but I doubt seriously that this testing involves boiling water. »</i></b><i><o:p></o:p></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I believe it is. See with Crispin.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« I don’t yet see it worth my while to review any of these. Pleas give a better cite for your top two of the above and I will try to report on its relevance to the issue of retaining the existing WBT. »</i></b><i><o:p></o:p></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I don’t know which one are the top two. They seem all relevant.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>So, do you know any reviews about the WBT?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Not ETHOS presentations, actual reviews about the validity of the protocol.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>« For time reasons, I have chosen not to read the other two documents at your recommended site. »<o:p></o:p></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>We cannot make progress if we don’t look and spend time considering alternative testing protocols.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>We certainly shouldn’t be wasting hours discussing: « oh, there are no alternatives and let’s wait for the ISO to develop something, at some point. » when we don’t even want to look at what stands before our eyes.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>What I fail to understand is the fact you are, Ron, setting your eyes for the first time on the CSI and HTP protocols, that are alternatives to the WBT.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I have the feeling you are not the only one, I feel some are supporting the WBT, thinking it is the only option we have, that there exist no other alternatives. Yet they have never even read the alternatives. A scientific mind should be curious and ready to challenge their assumptions, all the time. Science is always evolving.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The HTP exists, if I am correct, since 2010.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>7 years!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Ron, I hope you will really take the time, to read the protocols and the studies. It is not so long.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>It is really important, and you might see some really interesting points being made.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>We have to take the time. To take the time to do the right thing, to correct the past mistakes, to move forward, we have to take the time to stop wasting time.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><br>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><br>Xavier<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>De :</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Ronal W. Larson [<a href="mailto:rongretlarson@comcast.net">mailto:rongretlarson@comcast.net</a>] <br><b>Envoyé :</b> jeudi 31 août 2017 06:16<br><b>À :</b> Xavier Brandao<br><b>Cc :</b> Discussion of biomass; Crispin Pemberton-Pigott; Karin Troncoso; Tom Miles<br><b>Objet :</b> Re: [Stoves] News: National Geographic on promotion of gas stoves over improved woodstoves - in Guatemala<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Xavier and ccs<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span>Thanks for a courteous reply with good questions. See a start below. (Start because you gave me a lot of homework. Thanks especially for providing a great set of cites at the end (but no time yet to review any.)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Aug 30, 2017, at 5:13 PM, Xavier Brandao <<a href="mailto:xav.brandao@gmail.com">xav.brandao@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dear Ron,</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>« </span><b>The ISO process is open to every country - and is progressing well mostly (I listen in from time to time). »</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The gates are open, but I don’t know how to pass through them. Sally Seitz and Ranyee Chiang kindly asked me if wanted to get updates from the TC 285 discussions, I said yes. Several times. I am still waiting. I asked the AFNOR in Paris, but it doesn’t seem like having France as part of the TC 285 is one of their priorities.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The ISO is a black box to me. If anyone can direct me to regular sources of information or ways I can join, I’d be most thankful.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL1: Your statement that ISO is a black box answers many of the questions below. It is imperative that you learn how ISO works. Your best route would seem to be AFNOR - since you are French. I work only through ANSI - not ISO.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>I presume Sally and Ranyee thought that you would start with AFNOR. Updates have been given at the last several ETOS meetings and I have written about those updates (which were very well done). We are going to miss Ranyee.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>Can anyone help bring Xavier and AFNOR together? I repeat to Xavier - until you are part of the ISO process - you will be making a mistake in decrying it.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><br><br></b><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b>« The WBT IS valuable »</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Can you explain what is valuable about the WBT?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL2: My favorite on this topic is Jim Jetter. See presentations at several ETHOS meetings. I speak selfishly when I note that TLUDs shine at the WBT. I suspect some don’t like the WBT because their favorite technology doesn’t shine. By shine and value I mean that the WBT is behind most of the tier rankings - which long ago were accepted unanimously as the right way to proceed with stove improvement at this time. To me the WBT is all about improvement. If you can’t measure something, it won’t be improved. I disagree with those especially who say that there is no proven connection between measured CO and PM values in the lab and in the field. If not obtained with today’s WBT, what test is to be preferred? (answer in next question.)</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b> </b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b>« and should stay until replaced with something better »</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>There is already something better! Better is not right word: there is already something valid, as opposed to the invalidity of the WBT. There’s be something valid for a long time.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>There are the CSI method and HTP protocol.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>They are here, I sent the link to you long ago:</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><a href="https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B5rmmRmIsdlnQlRQX3A1cXVOQ3M?usp=sharing"><span style='color:purple'>https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B5rmmRmIsdlnQlRQX3A1cXVOQ3M?usp=sharing</span></a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Tell me why you think they cannot replace the WBT?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL3: </b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b>The documents I found at your above cite were from the South African SETAR. I stopped reading when I read this sentence in the last of the four there: “<i>A cooking session using a </i><o:p></o:p></b></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i>system with a heat flux rate of 2 W/cm 2 will boil 5 liters of water in under 25 minutes.” </i></b><b>Sounds like a WBT to me - and the ISO process is encouraging such diversity in different countries. But ISO has accepted the challenge of an international version - not mandated to be used by everyone. Somebody please tell me I am missing something on WBTs.<o:p></o:p></b></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><o:p> </o:p></b></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>The first (HTP) document similarly measures water temperature rise - albeit a little differently. I view the accuracy of the results to be so dependent on the user that whether it is one run with water loss in an uncovered pan or only concentrating on the regime where water loss is minimal and rate of temperature rise makes little difference to me. I am using the term WBT to mean that a water-containing pot is involved. I may be wrong but this HTP test seems to assume there is no production of charcoal. I predict this lack will cause a change at some point (and may be the reason we hear little favorable about TLUDs from South Africa (even though there are several capable TLUD manufacturers in South Africa. I hope they will chime in on the value of a stove test that assumes charcoal has no value.<o:p></o:p></b></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><o:p> </o:p></b></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>For time reasons, I have chosen not to read the other two documents at your recommended site. Apologies in advance for that lapse and for apparently not saying something earlier about this site - which seems to strongly support the use of pots of water in stove testing (as do EVERY other test procedure I am aware of). No reason to talk of cooking rice or boiling oils- when boiling water is so universal.<o:p></o:p></b></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><o:p> </o:p></b></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Tom, this question is also addressed to you, since last time, I think you were saying there wasn’t yet an alternative.<br>What is so unique about the WBT that cannot be done by the CSI nor HTP?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b> </b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b>All “the experts” I trust are advocating continued use of the WBT.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Ron, can you please list all the experts who, now, today, still advocate continued use of the WBT?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I know there is you, and there is Dean Still with whom I discussed over emails.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Can you please name these experts Ron?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <b>[RWL4: As I have said before, I consider Jim Jetter as especially knowledgeable. John Mitchell, also of EPA, knows a huge amount about stove testing. Look at who has spoken at ETHOS meetings on these topics. Ranyee Chiang will be hugely missed at GACC. Professor Tami Bond is great - as well as some of her graduate students. Berkeley is full of competent stove people - starting with Dr. Michael Johnson. See </b><a href="http://berkeleyair.com/about-us/staff/">http://berkeleyair.com/about-us/staff/</a> <b>for others who really know their stove measurementstuff. I am not claiming support from Professor Kirk Smith, but his name is on at least one paper with Jetter. And both DoE and EPA funded 3-4 groups - mostly at Universities. I won’t try to mention all their names, but they are at schools such as CSU and U Washington. Again - see their presentations at ETHOS. No guarantee they support the WBT - but I look forward to hearing if any of those mentioned disown it.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>On this list, I especially list Tom Miles and Andrew Heggie as likely supporters of the WBT. </b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>Dean Still has been in this a long time and I also trust his judgement - which in part goes back to a premier early stove investigator - Dr. Sam Baldwin. I have talked to Sam quite often and have never heard any concern that the WBT was inappropriate. My concern was about making char and using the “denominator” equation - which seems to be the main dispute which I have been having for years with Crispin. And also you??</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>One person I am excluding from this list is myself. I have no experience with monitoring either CO or PM. I especially like measuring water evaporated because I have made a lot of progress on char-making stove improvement by using a simplified WBT. I have heard Kirk Harris say the same.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>Apologies to anyone I missed or mislabeled.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>You are talking about « Crispin’s » experts. I cannot help but think about the people who reviewed the CSI and HTP and highlighted the problems with the WBT.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The 2 (long) lists are below this email.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL5: I’ll get back to this - but I repeat that South Africa seems to support the general concept of monitoring the change in water properties in pots sitting on stoves.</b><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Ron, can you please critique their work? Critique the reviews or the studies? What is it that you don’t agree with?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Ron, or anyone, can you please share a list of reviews of the WBT protocol?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>As you said Ron, the WBT has been used for decades. It shouldn’t be difficult then to get a list of reviews by external researchers showing how scientifically valid the WBT is.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL6: I can assure you that Jim Jetter, who has written extensively on stove testing, defends the WBT. He also leads the ISO effort - which WOULD NOT be finishing if there were any doubt as to the validity of the WBT. If it is not yet clear, I am claiming you are in a small minority of “experts”.</b><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>7 months ago, the 26/01, I asked you Ron on this List several very specific questions, referring to the WBT issues.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>You never responded.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL7: Apologies if I didn’t respond, but I do know that I contacted many of the principal authors (and I think Riva) and think I might have reported. I am pretty sure that the basic WBT approach was not in doubt with them. What was in question was only (??) how many replications needed to be made to ALWAYS achieve what they considered a minimum level of accuracy.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><br><br></b><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I ask you these questions again, they refer to the text of the paper of Riva and al., paper that you can find here:</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a href="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/308898807_Fuzzy_interval_propagation_of_uncertainties_in_experimental_analysis_for_improved_and_traditional_three_-_Stone_fire_cookstoves"><span style='color:purple'>https://www.researchgate.net/publication/308898807_Fuzzy_interval_propagation_of_uncertainties_in_experimental_analysis_for_improved_and_traditional_three_-_Stone_fire_cookstoves</span></a><span class=apple-converted-space> </span>:</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Ron, in the WBT,</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;mso-list:l9 level1 lfo2'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>do you contest the role of thermodynamic uncertainties (viz. variable steam production and boiling point determination) on results repeatability? Can you ensure there are no uncertainties? </span><o:p></o:p></li></ul></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>RWL: I cannot so ensure - since most of my efforts along these lines was more than 20 years ago. I am sure that there are uncertainties, since many properties DO vary with altitude. But I have seen no uncertainty that applies to placing stoves at a single testing center into incorrect tiers (as measured to tenths of a tier). Boiling point determination can be different - but when you run for an hour, this is of disappearing importance, compared to who did the testing. And, if you don’t use a WBT, what do you replace it with?</b><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;mso-list:l22 level1 lfo3'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Of if there are, can you ensure they have no effect on results repeatability? How?</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL: I believe the existing uncertainties are acceptable - being much smaller than other known causes for measurement differences. Is there any group anywhere that has avoided all the concerns you think exist? A much bigger error for me lies with those who claim you should ignore the weight of any charcoal produced.</b><br><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo4'><o:p> </o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo4'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>do you have an answer to the questions about the rationale of some calculations raised by Zhang et al.?</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL: Give me more to go on.</b><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;mso-list:l13 level1 lfo5'><o:p> </o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;mso-list:l13 level1 lfo5'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>do you support the statistical approach recommended by this standardised laboratory-based test (the WBT) to evaluate, communicate and compare performances and emissions of tested stoves, i.e. using the arithmetic average of three replicate tests? How do you guarantee this statistical approach ensure good comparison of stove performances?</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL: Yes I can support the use of just three tests - if they are “relatively” close together in all tier statistics. If one test if vastly different than the other two, then additional testing should take place. The main reason for accepting three is trying to keep costs low. I gather that one can make some useful statistical importance with just two tests.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>The arithmetic average is not the only data that should be given - each result should be (and is usually, I believe) given. <br><br></b><o:p></o:p></p><div><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;mso-list:l20 level1 lfo6'><o:p> </o:p></li></ul><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Best,</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Xavier</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><u><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Reviews of the HTP and CSI</span></u><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;background:white'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The HTP was officially reviewed by an external expert group as required by the IWA 2012:11. The World Bank office in Beijing commissioned SGS Netherlands which provided a report after investigating the equipment, test protocol and calculations.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL: Where do I go read that? (It is getting too late to find, read, and report back). This one looks important.</b><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;background:white'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;background:white'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The Ulaanbaatar Clean Air Project test method for approving stove performance is the HTP before the CSI contextual portion was added, though the test conducted is in fact based on current observed practice. The Ulaanbaatar Clean Air Project test method has been reviewed and/or approved by:</span><o:p></o:p></p><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l18 level2 lfo7;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Mongolian University of Science and Technology, Prof Tseyen-Oidov and others</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l18 level2 lfo7;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Ulaanbaatar Clean Air Project, Operations Manager & Chief Engineer, Ms D Tsendsuren<span class=apple-converted-space> </span></span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l18 level2 lfo7;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Dr B Odonkhishig and Dr Jargalsaikhan Buriad, head and Director, respectively, of the SEET Laboratory in Ulaanbaatar</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l18 level2 lfo7;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>SGS Laboratories, Netherlands (who conduct most of the stove tests for EU certification), WB contract</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l18 level2 lfo7;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Team experts under Akeo Fukuyama, from the Environment Division of JICA contractor Suuri-Keikaku Co. Ltd.</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l18 level2 lfo7;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Millennium Challenge Account – Mongolia (MCA-Mongolia is the local branch of the Millennium Challenge C<a name="_GoBack"></a>orporation, USA) which spend $20m on stove subsidies based on the results of the tests<span class=apple-converted-space> </span></span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l18 level2 lfo7;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>National University of Mongolia, Prof Lodoysamba, Innovation Manager, Department of Research (nuclear physicist and air quality expert)</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l18 level2 lfo7;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>GTZ building energy efficiency program in Ulaanbaatar, headed by Ruth Erlbeck (reviewed by her head technical man and a young German MSc physicist Mr Henning Schulte-Huxel who wrote a lot of the chemical balance calculation block on the FUELS tab)</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul></ul></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL: Please correct me if wrong, but I don’t believe this test is at all applicable to cook stoves; it may or may not have some value for cook stoves - but I doubt seriously that this testing involves boiling water.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l17 level2 lfo8;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><o:p> </o:p></li></ul></ul><p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;background:white'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The CSI Test Protocol which includes the contextual test method appended to the HTP test method and calculations has been reviewed by:</span><o:p></o:p></p><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>World Bank technical review team for Indonesia (their infrastructure engineer and technical reviewer)</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>College of Engineering, China Agricultural University (CAU), Prof Renjie Dong, head of the National Key Laboratory for Biogas, reviewed it at the request of the Senior Economist heading the CSI-Indonesia Pilot</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Yixiang Zhang, PhD candidate, College of engineering, CAU. He has published several reviews of certain aspects of the test method and its calculations.</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Degan Ostogic, Lead Energy specialist (engineer) in the WB Energy and Extractives supervising the CSI-Indonesia Stove Pilot, he also required a demonstration of the method in action.</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>The head of stove testing at a Western nation’s national regulatory body has reviewed the method for generating the Technical Test from a set of Cooking Tests. This provides the contextual element of the CSI Method.</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Prof Harold Annegarn, nuclear physicist, then at the Department of Geography Environmental Management and Energy Studies, University of Johannesburg</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Engineer David Beritault, formerly with GERES, for years the head of the Cambodian stove testing lab and now with CARITAS Switzerland, made a very detailed review of the concepts and calculations underlying the method. He is a co-author of ISO TC-285 WG2, 19867 Part 2.</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>James Robinson, BSc (Eng), MSc (Eng), MSc (aeronautics), former head of the SeTAR Centre, University of Johannesburg.</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Dr Tafadzwa Makonese, Head of the SeTAR Centre, Research Village, University of Johannesburg<span class=apple-converted-space> </span></span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo9;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Indonesian BNI (National Standards Body technical committee) made a conceptual review with the intention of replacing their current Draft National Standard (which at present uses an early SeTAR Centre heat transfer efficiency test protocol, the forerunner of the HTP.</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul></ul></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>[RWL: I haven’t had time to review any of these, but note again that the CSI test does involve boiling water. I don’t yet see it worth my while to review any of these. Pleas give a better cite for your top two of the above and I will try to report on its relevance to the issue of retaining the existing WBT.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal> <span class=apple-tab-span> </span><b>The following list looks quite interesting, but too late to try to look at any, much less all. I’ll try to get at these ASAP, but would appreciate knowing of those that take specific exception anything I have said above.</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-tab-span><b> </b></span><b>Xavier - please tell me where I have let you down in the above. Anyone else find my responses insufficient?</b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b>Ron<br></b><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;text-align:justify;mso-list:l16 level2 lfo10;background:white;background-position:initial initial;background-repeat:initial initial'><o:p> </o:p></li></ul></ul><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><u><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Papers pointing at issues with the WBT</span></u><o:p></o:p></p></div><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l0 level1 lfo11'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Fuzzy interval propagation of uncertainties in experimental analysis for improved and traditional three–stone fire cookstoves</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><br><a href="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/308898807_Fuzzy_interval_propagation_of_uncertainties_in_experimental_analysis_for_improved_and_traditional_three_-_Stone_fire_cookstoves"><span style='color:purple'>https://www.researchgate.net/publication/308898807_Fuzzy_interval_propagation_of_uncertainties_in_experimental_analysis_for_improved_and_traditional_three_-_Stone_fire_cookstoves</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l10 level1 lfo12'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Key differences of performance test protocols for household biomass cookstoves. Twenty-Second Domestic Use of Energy, IEEE 2014:1–11.</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><br><a href="http://energyuse.org.za/document-archive/"><span style='color:purple'>http://energyuse.org.za/document-archive/</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>To access the file, select DUE [Domestic Use of energy COnference]. Select DUE 2014. Select PROCEEDINGS. Select paper by Zhang etal (PDFs arranged alphabetically).</span><o:p></o:p></p><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l1 level1 lfo13'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Performance testing for monitoring improved biomass stove interventions: experiences of the Household Energy and Health Project. Energy Sustainable Dev 2007;11:57–70.<span class=apple-converted-space> </span></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><br><a href="http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.461.783&rep=rep1&type=pdf"><span style='color:purple'>http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.461.783&rep=rep1&type=pdf</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l14 level1 lfo14'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The shortcomings of the U.S. protocol</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><br><a href="http://lib.dr.iastate.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1534&context=etd"><span style='color:purple'>http://lib.dr.iastate.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1534&context=etd</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l7 level1 lfo15'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Influence of testing parameters on biomass stove performance and development of an improved testing protocol</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><br><a href="https://envirofit.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/2012-influence-of-testing-parameters.pdf"><span style='color:purple'>https://envirofit.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/2012-influence-of-testing-parameters.pdf</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l6 level1 lfo16'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>How many replicate tests are needed to test cookstove performance and emissions? — Three is not always adequate.</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><br><a href="http://gadgillab.berkeley.edu/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/D-13-00075-Wang-et-al._final.pdf"><span style='color:purple'>http://gadgillab.berkeley.edu/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/D-13-00075-Wang-et-al._final.pdf</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l15 level1 lfo17'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Systematic and conceptual errors in standards and protocols for thermal performance of biomass stoves</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><br><a href="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/309689616_Systematic_and_conceptual_errors_in_standards_and_protocols_for_thermal_performance_of_biomass_stoves"><span style='color:purple'>https://www.researchgate.net/publication/309689616_Systematic_and_conceptual_errors_in_standards_and_protocols_for_thermal_performance_of_biomass_stoves</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l23 level1 lfo18'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Quality assurance for cookstoves testing centers: calculation of expanded uncertainty for WBT<br></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><a href="http://www.newdawnengineering.com/website/library/Stove%20Testing/Testing%20Protocols/American%20WBT,%20CCT,%20KPT/2014%20March%20WBT%204.2.x%20Uncertainty,%20Gorrity,%20M.pdf"><span style='color:purple'>http://www.newdawnengineering.com/website/library/Stove%20Testing/Testing%20Protocols/American%20WBT,%20CCT,%20KPT/2014%20March%20WBT%204.2.x%20Uncertainty,%20Gorrity,%20M.pdf</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l4 level1 lfo19'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Key factors of thermal efficiency test protocols</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><br><a href="http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.1000.3936&rep=rep1&type=pdf"><span style='color:purple'>http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.1000.3936&rep=rep1&type=pdf</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><ul style='margin-top:0cm' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:#1F497D;mso-list:l12 level1 lfo20'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Towards a standard for clean solid-fuelled cookstoves</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'> <span class=apple-converted-space> </span><a href="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/274706950_Towards_a_standard_for_clean_solid-fuelled_cookstoves"><span style='color:purple'>https://www.researchgate.net/publication/274706950_Towards_a_standard_for_clean_solid-fuelled_cookstoves</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>