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<p><font size="+1">Dear Nikhil,</font><br>
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/16/17 1:11 PM, Nikhil Desai
wrote:<br>
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<div>Frank:</div>
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<div>It gets complicated, way complicated, very soon, from
public policy perspective. Unless you narrow the inquiry
down to specific location and period. <br>
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The USCC used 'stakeholders?' to develop the test methods and
interpretations. Regulated itself regarding certified labs. EPA
required the heavy metals and bacteria reuirements. The labels were
also regulated under Gov. regulations. Canada had different
regulations for metals etc. and each State could require more
stricter regulations. But the USCC (like a group we could make up)
ran the program. <br>
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<div>It is not often that you can control fuel quality and
reliability of supplies. People vary crops and they also
vary trees. Who collects and delivers what biomass is an
issue of land rights; access to public trees for trimming,
pruning, and total taking down of the tree; opportunity cost
of labor and capital for establishing and sustaining a fuel
supply enterprise; and, of course, sales and service network
for new types of stoves. <br>
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This was easy for the old WBT. They used a 'lookup' value for the
fuel and this one value used for all the biomass fuels. Very easy. :
)<br>
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Cooking is not a scientist enterprise at all. </div>
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It is if you look at it from a bigger picture. <br>
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The challenge is not only user-centred, reiterative
engineering, but placing it in the institutional and
cultural context. Scientists, cooks, policymakers, lawyers,
financiers all need to come together to make a promising
project. <br>
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Yes - lets do that!<br>
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<div><br>
Nikhil <br>
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Frank<br>
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On Dec 14, 2017, at 10:41 PM, Frank Shields <<a
href="mailto:franke@cruzio.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">franke@cruzio.com</a>> wrote:<br>
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<p><font size="+1">Dear Nikhil,</font></p>
<p>My main issue is that we need to look at the complete
picture of a receiving site and approach it like
scientist. We will not achieve cleaner air, fuel savings
and such until we do. We need to separate variables (as
I have) and control them. Not as complex as it seems. <br>
</p>
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<div class="m_1053680817048434996moz-cite-prefix">On
12/14/17 5:24 PM, Nikhil Desai wrote:<br>
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<div dir="ltr">Frank: <br>
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<snip><br>
In the example below, I would add fuel chemistry;
"good fuel" part is contextual. Say, if I were to take
over the cooking market in a given geography
completely - 100,000 stoves of various sizes and
shapes replaced by, or supplemented by, 100,000 new
ones. I am sure biomass is going to vary and so are
stoves - in some Indian villages, one stove and fuel
for making tea, another to cook animal feed, and a
third one for heating water, a fourth one for daily
dinners, with each of them some other use other than
the primary ones.
<div><br>
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<div>So, to establish market prospects in a given
area, you would have to test maybe six kinds of
fuels and four major uses to accommodate in two
"intervention designs". <br>
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I have a (starter) test package for biomass fuels. I
suggest the stoves be sold with a description of the fuel
that should be used and upper and lower limits. Then
suggested means of delivering that fuel to combustion
chamber. That covers Box-1, Box-2 and the stove Box-3.
Many different Rocket type stoves will take the same fuel.
And likely the same with TLUD types. Then the wild biomass
is collected at the receiving site and prepared for the
stoves. It is tested to see how well it fits for the
stove. The rest is for Cecil and like. There need be a
place where the biomass is collected and prepared (tested)
and then delivered. Nothing improves unless the proper
fuel is used in the right stove. <br>
<br>
Most stoves that use stick fuel (rocket) or chipped fuel
(TLUD) will not need a lot of testing. Acorns, grasses,
pressed and briquets, and odd fuels will require more
testing and, I think, this program more helpful. <br>
<br>
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<div>Then you blow me away with your view - "Whats
important is what the end user decides important.
Now all steps are controlled and should be
repeatable."<br>
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I'm thinking if fuel is optimized and delivered stacked to
the user the user will be pleased and more likely to go
along with the program (Cecil?). And using the right fuel
results in positive change over established. <br>
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<div>And suddenly you come up with the revolutionary
advice "Because no-one else is doing the same system
you will not be able to compare to other systems.
But you might be able to improve your own. And there
are lots of measurements for the fuel that can be
made (not described here) but use simple test
methods and no need for a real lab. Perhaps just
some basic equipment." <br>
<br>
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I suggest to Michael the 6-Box system. But because no one
is using it his single point data will not be of much use.
We need many tests for comparison and improving. I'm
thinking each receiving site (village?) has its own fuel
and own tasks to complete. If the goal is to improve a
Village then the approach must be village wide. Help
provide the people with the fuel and combustion chamber
that will best complete the task they want done. <br>
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<div>To me, that is a lot better way of proving and
improving a combustion device than to game the WBT.
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The WBT went from fuel to task. That is good. But the
method of collecting and interpretating data produced was
way off base IMO. A good test if completely redone. <br>
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<div>Nikhil</div>
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Regards<br>
<br>
Frank<br>
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<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Dec 11, 2017 at
11:13 PM, Frank Shields <span dir="ltr"><<a
href="mailto:franke@cruzio.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">franke@cruzio.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
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<p><font size="+1">Hi Michael, Stovers;<br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">This is a good example
where the 6-Box system would be useful.
<br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Set up the system so it
makes good tea. The process is to
control the variables and modify one at
a time to improve the process. There are
lots of steps you can do but would take
some time, test methods and a little
equipment. All simple but not good at
this time. Once you have a good fuel,
good technique, and can produce a good
cup of tea I suggest the following:</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Box-1) Observe the fuel
for size, moisture, cleanliness etc. <br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Box - 2: Record the
process loading the combustion chamber.</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Box- 3: Record the
combustion chamber; stove model etc.</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Box-4: Establish info
regarding the utensils used; metal,
size, heavy-light etc.</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Box-5: Record the
process; stirring, amount of water,
amount of tea, sugar added etc.</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Box-6: Determine a good
repeatable Completion Point. Perhaps
water just starts to boil or i can hold
my hand on the side of the pot for just
one second.</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">You need to know what an
improvement would look like for you.
Quicker tea but not care of amount of
fuel. Save on fuel, walk away with less
manipulation, air quality, amount of
char left, quality of char produced,
etc. Whats important is what the end
user decides important. <br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="+1"> <br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Now all steps are
controlled and should be repeatable. You
can change one Box at a time and see if
that improves the process. Use dryer
wood or stir more frequently. Use a
lighter pot or less water. Add wood more
frequent in smaller quantities - try to
get the best conditions. <br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Because no-one else is
doing the same system you will not be
able to compare to other systems. But
you might be able to improve your own.
And there are lots of measurements for
the fuel that can be made (not described
here) but use simple test methods and no
need for a real lab. Perhaps just some
basic equipment. <br>
</font></p>
<br>
<p><font size="+1">Frank</font></p>
<p><font size="+1">Gabilan Laboratory<br>
</font></p>
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<pre class="m_1053680817048434996moz-signature" cols="72">--
Frank Shields
444 Main Street Apt. 4205
Watsonville, CA 95076
<a href="tel:%28831%29%20246-0417" value="+18312460417" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">(831) 246-0417</a> cell
<a class="m_1053680817048434996moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:franke@cruzio.com" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">franke@cruzio.com</a></pre>
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<div><franke.vcf></div>
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<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Frank Shields
444 Main Street Apt. 4205
Watsonville, CA 95076
(831) 246-0417 cell
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:franke@cruzio.com">franke@cruzio.com</a></pre>
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