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Crispin,<br>
<br>
My memory of that discussion is vague. And I do not have active
contacts in Indonesia. Could you please try to get some updated
info about thoae stoves and the fuel usage and the char production
and the destination of that char? <br>
<br>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>
Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.drtlud.com">www.drtlud.com</a></pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/24/2017 10:43 AM, Crispin
Pemberton-Pigott wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
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<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Dear
Paul<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Char as
a product with value:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Do you
remember me talking about how the candle nut shells made
really strong charcoal that was eminently shippable over
long distances? It was about the islands NE of Java where
there are plenty of candle nut shells and not much wood, or
not as much wood. Dr Nurhuda introduced (through government
as I recall) some TLUD gasifiers and made very good quality
charcoal from those shells. The people were happy with the
whole idea.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">It was
about 2013 or 14. Do you remember? That is something that
should be pursued because the object lesson will be a good
one. Candle nuts will continue to be an important crop, more
in the future than now, and they are a really good fuel if
the chamber is sized appropriately. The result is a
physically strong half-shell that has good properties as a
fuel.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">As
charcoal becomes more popular as an urban fuel, particularly
for food selling businesses, like those on pedal-powered
three-wheelers, there is a ready market.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Regards<br>
Crispin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:windowtext;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Ron and Julien,<br>
<br>
Good that your did the monetary exchange rates and the
conversion from C to CO2e to get the cost per ton. That
needs to be done with the raw numbers for the Deganga TLUD
project in India. I will ask the project implementer to make
those calculations and sent them to me. <br>
<br>
We need to build the case for the value of the char from TLUD
stoves. Whether sold to be burned or to be used as biochar
is not the issue.
<br>
<br>
I have not heard of other TLUD projects with selling of the
charcoal made in TLUDs. Maybe Prime has an example???<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<pre>Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Email: <a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu" moz-do-not-send="true">psanders@ilstu.edu</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Website: <a href="https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.drtlud.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C14287bfb6be541ddb2b108d54a86b89e%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636496864832447359&sdata=aTtvV0ONKqGiGXWR%2B0eCVAyW%2B%2BvkOf0p7a9syEn7%2F18%3D&reserved=0" moz-do-not-send="true">www.drtlud.com</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 12/23/2017 1:01 AM, Ronal W. Larson
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal">Stoves List: (many on this list are also
biochar list members - so apologies for sending this twice.)
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="apple-tab-span">
</span>I could have used many ways to make biochar as I
supported a French CDR (carbon dioxide removal) person,
who objected to the way 3 organizers of a future CDR
conference were describing all CDR approaches as
“controversial". I chose Dr. Julien’s message to this
list because I think it really well proves the beauty of
char-making stoves, while also making a real positive
statement about both biochar’s CDR’s potential. So many
thanks to Julien for his message a few weeks ago.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="apple-tab-span">
</span>i just looked up the value of a “tk” = Taka, which
is 1.2 cents. So the woman quoted below made $9.00 in a
“few months” just in charcoal - but also was buying less
wood. And someone else was making money off increased
soil productivity and less expense for fertilizer. The
price for her char was (at 1000 times 12 cents) $120/tonne
char. This is about $40 tonne CO2 - and many CDR
approaches are bragging they can get down to $100/tonne
CO2.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="apple-tab-span">
</span>Anyone on this list see why biochar (and
char-making stoves) should be “controversial? (This
thread being about CDR controversiality.)<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Ron<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Begin forwarded message:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica neue"">From:
</span></b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica neue"">"Ronal
W. Larson" <<a
href="mailto:rongretlarson@comcast.net"
moz-do-not-send="true">rongretlarson@comcast.net</a>></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica neue"">Subject:
Fwd: [CDR] [geo] EASST 2018 - CfP - The
politics of negative emissions</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica neue"">Date:
</span></b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica neue"">December
22, 2017 at 11:34:52 PM MST</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica neue"">To:
</span></b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica neue"">Biochar
<<a href="mailto:biochar@yahoogroups.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">biochar@yahoogroups.com</a>></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">List: <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
class="apple-tab-span"> </span>I
suggest below that biochar proponents
<b><u>not</u></b> attend a meeting where
biochar will certainly be discussed. But if
anyone can attend this meeting (time and place
TBD), you might have a very interesting time.
I do of course hope some list member will be
able to submit an abstract per instructions
at <a
href="https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fnomadit.co.uk%2Feasst%2Feasst2018%2Fconferencesuite.php%2Fpanels%2F6270&data=02%7C01%7C%7C14287bfb6be541ddb2b108d54a86b89e%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636496864832447359&sdata=SKnOlCwtFeSSJljGcgp265ZnCFRK4z7RjS3UE7zkRcw%3D&reserved=0"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://nomadit.co.uk/easst/easst2018/conferencesuite.php/panels/6270</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Ron<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Begin forwarded
message:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue"">From: </span></b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue"">"Ronal W. Larson" <<a
href="mailto:rongretlarson@comcast.net"
moz-do-not-send="true">rongretlarson@comcast.net</a>></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue"">Subject: Re: [CDR] [geo]
EASST 2018 - CfP - The politics of
negative emissions</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue"">Date: </span></b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue"">December 22, 2017 at
11:22:16 PM MST</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue"">To: </span></b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue"">Renaud de RICHTER <<a
href="mailto:renaud.derichter@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">renaud.derichter@gmail.com</a>>,
Carbon Dioxide Removal <<a
href="mailto:CarbonDioxideRemoval@googlegroups.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">CarbonDioxideRemoval@googlegroups.com</a>></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue"">Cc: </span></b><span
style="font-family:"helvetica
neue""><a
href="mailto:n.markusson@lancaster.ac.uk"
moz-do-not-send="true">n.markusson@lancaster.ac.uk</a>,
<a
href="mailto:rob.bellamy@insis.ox.ac.uk"
moz-do-not-send="true">rob.bellamy@insis.ox.ac.uk</a>,
<a
href="mailto:d.mclaren@lancaster.ac.uk"
moz-do-not-send="true">
d.mclaren@lancaster.ac.uk</a>, RAU
greg <<a
href="mailto:ghrau@sbcglobal.net"
moz-do-not-send="true">ghrau@sbcglobal.net</a>></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Dr. de Richter
and CDR list<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span>1. Thanks for your
contribution - adding the word
“some”. I like your emphasis on
methane and N2O removal via solar
towers; biochar can do some of the
same.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span>2. Being active on the
biochar side of CDR, I was very
pleased to hear this past month of a
successful biochar operation in a
report on a “stoves” list by Dr.
Julien Winter. His Bangladesh
biochar organization’s website had
two articles on a new stove type
that both used less wood and
produced about 20% charcoal, which
is being placed in soil as biochar.
The articles and a brief excerpt
from each are:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.biochar-bangladesh.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2017%2F02%2F2016_06_03_TheNewNation.pdf&data=02%7C01%7C%7C14287bfb6be541ddb2b108d54a86b89e%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636496864832447359&sdata=4QN14J46s0spY7UqynWZRq8egblmbmpRJZg5kiKcRi8%3D&reserved=0"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span>a. One and a half years
ago:
http://www.biochar-bangladesh.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/2016_06_03_TheNewNation.pdf</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span><i>If one household burning
3kg of wood per day produced 0.6kg
of biochar per day, they would
have 18kg of biochar per month.
For a village of 500 households,
that could amount to 108,000 kg
biochar per year. Across the
landscape, the people of
Bangladesh could become the
World’s largest per capita
sequesters of carbon. This is, as
a by-product of cooking without
cutting any additional forest. </i><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.biochar-bangladesh.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2017%2F02%2F2016_12_11_DhakaTribune_Akha.pdf&data=02%7C01%7C%7C14287bfb6be541ddb2b108d54a86b89e%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636496864832447359&sdata=2Fin0KW45wS1d2CtcfHXD0WPMB7e4YsnlZcy9l9r5qA%3D&reserved=0"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span>b. One year ago:
http://www.biochar-bangladesh.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/2016_12_11_DhakaTribune_Akha.pdf</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span><i>In Manikganj, Monkhusi
Halder has been using them for a
few months and she sells the
bio-char to farmers as fertiliser,
making some extra cash along with
dinner. “I have been using this
stove for the last few months and
sold 75kgs of bio-char for Tk10
per kg, reducing the cost of
fuel,” Monkhusi told the Dhaka
Tribune while using her Akha
stove. Khorshed Ali, a farmer in
Manikganj, was visibly excited
about the new bio-char fertiliser.</i><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span>These articles are not
emphasizing CDR - but there is zero
conflict with soil improvements,
increased food production and,
income generation. And trivial
investment- we heard the stoves cost
about $20.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.biochar-international.org%2Fnetwork%2Fcommunities&data=02%7C01%7C%7C14287bfb6be541ddb2b108d54a86b89e%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636496864832447359&sdata=05xKGawtfAa9sZrcg%2F5MS%2BjtsgGv9IouQ9qkxCHOxEY%3D&reserved=0"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span>3. At
http://www.biochar-international.org/network/communities</a>
you can see the names of more than
50 similar regional biochar groups.
About 10 years ago, there was only
IBI, the International Biochar
Initiative (see same site for its
10-year history) . Does any other
CDR approach have 10% as much global
grassroots CDR support? What is
the evidence that biochar is
“deeply controversial”? I don’t
believe China is finding the subject
controversial; the IBI site
describes a very aggressive 5-year
plan that is well along. China is
clearly the world biochar leader -
and the IBI headquarters has been
moved there.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
class="apple-tab-span">
</span>4. I now find it difficult
to encourage any biochar supporter
to attend this meeting. Pity - as
we need more multi-CDR meetings - if
the discussion is not pre-ordained
to prove universal
“controversiality”.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Ron<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Dec 22,
2017, at 1:10 PM, Renaud de
RICHTER <<a
href="mailto:renaud.derichter@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">renaud.derichter@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Does not
start very friendly:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">... <i><span
style="color:blue">Much
like their taxonomic
cousins, geoengineering
by reflecting sunlight
back into space,
negative emissions ideas
are also deeply
controversial,
potentially propping up
carbon capitalism,
making sweeping changes
to land-use and posing
significant
environmental risks.</span></i>
...<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Why not
adding the word "<b><i><span
style="color:red">some</span></i></b>"
just before "...
<i><span style="color:blue">negative
emissions ideas are also
deeply
controversial,..."</span></i><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
Nils, Rob & Duncan,
there are many NETs that are
not controversial, but are
just not yet well known nor
discussed.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Bw, and
Season's Greetings!<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">2017-12-22
20:31 GMT+01:00 Greg Rau
<<a
href="mailto:ghrau@sbcglobal.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">ghrau@sbcglobal.net</a>>:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p
class="gmail-msonormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><a
name="m_1803827614254045946__Hlk501703479"
moz-do-not-send="true">Dear all,<br>
<br>
We invite you
to submit
proposals for
papers to our
open panel</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p
class="gmail-msonormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">The
politics of
negative
emissions</span>
</b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p
class="gmail-msonormal">At
<i>Meetings –
Making
Science,
Technology and
Society
together</i>,
EASST2018
Conference,
Lancaster, UK,
25-28 July
2018 -
<a
href="https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Feasst2018.easst.net%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C14287bfb6be541ddb2b108d54a86b89e%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636496864832447359&sdata=xVXtRM8Xk7PISIwPE19aVBfM%2FPZekcRJ%2F%2FJkavoA57o%3D&reserved=0"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">
https://easst2018.easst.net/</a><br>
<br>
Convenors: <br>
Nils Markusson
(Lancaster
University) <a
href="mailto:n.markusson@lancaster.ac.uk" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">
n.markusson@lancaster.ac.uk</a><br>
Rob Bellamy
(University of
Oxford) <a
href="mailto:rob.bellamy@insis.ox.ac.uk"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">
rob.bellamy@insis.ox.ac.uk</a><br>
Duncan McLaren
(Lancaster
University) <a
href="mailto:d.mclaren@lancaster.ac.uk" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">
d.mclaren@lancaster.ac.uk</a><br>
<span
style="background:yellow"><br>
</span>The
Paris
Agreement on
climate change
has set out
global
commitments to
keeping global
warming well
below 2 °C
above
preindustrial
levels and to
aim for
limiting the
rise to 1.5
°C. The
Intergovernmental
Panel on
Climate Change
has concluded
that meeting
these targets
is possible –
but nearly all
of their
scenarios rely
on the
extensive
deployment of
large-scale
technologies
that remove
greenhouse
gases from the
atmosphere but
do not
currently
exist (as
complete
socio-technical
systems). Critics have argued that assumptions about when such ‘negative
emissions’
technologies
might be ready
and how they
might be
deployed at an
impactful
scale are
desperately
optimistic.
<span
style="background:yellow"><br>
<br>
</span>Much
like their
taxonomic
cousins,
geoengineering
by reflecting
sunlight back
into space,
negative
emissions
ideas are also
deeply
controversial,
potentially
propping up
carbon
capitalism,
making
sweeping
changes to
land-use and
posing
significant
environmental
risks. This
panel seeks to
explore the
politics of
these
prospective
negative
emissions
technologies
and what they
imply for our
changing
relationship
with nature in
the age of the
Anthropocene.
We ask: what
political
imaginaries
and interests
are
co-produced
with negative
emissions
ideas in
climate
models,
experiments
and policies?
How might
research,
development
and deployment
of carbon
removal be
governed
responsibly
where power
relations and
socio-technical systems are co-evolving? What are the implications for
power,
knowledge and
politics of
(discursive)
decoupling of
carbon removal
from other
forms of
geoengineering?
How does
negative
emissions
politics
compare to
other
technoscientific
politics? What
should our
roles as STS
scholars be
when engaging
with negative
emissions?<span
style="background:yellow"> <br>
<br>
</span>To
submit a paper
please go to <a
href="https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fnomadit.co.uk%2Feasst%2Feasst2018%2Fconferencesuite.php%2Fpanels%2F6270&data=02%7C01%7C%7C14287bfb6be541ddb2b108d54a86b89e%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636496864832447359&sdata=SKnOlCwtFeSSJljGcgp265ZnCFRK4z7RjS3UE7zkRcw%3D&reserved=0"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">
https://nomadit.co.uk/easst/easst2018/conferencesuite.php/panels/6270</a><span
style="background:yellow"><br>
</span>The
call for
papers closes
at midnight
CET on 14
February,
2018.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p
class="gmail-msonormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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