<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class="">Xavier cc list</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>Art first, I thought I would respond (up to now you have been quite decent) , but when I got to the end I decided not. I just don’t see much value in responding given your low feelings about my opinions. Ie you say below (these are called ad hominem):</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><i class=""><font color="#1f497d" face="Calibri, sans-serif" class=""><span style="font-size: 15px;" class="">“You have beaten your own olympic record in intellectual dishonesty,</span></font></i><font color="#1f497d" face="Calibri, sans-serif" class=""><span style="font-size: 15px;" class=""> </span></font><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;" class="">Congratulations, because it was not an easy task."</span></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="Section1" style="page: Section1;"><div class="" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;"><span class=""><i class=""><font color="#1f497d" face="Calibri, sans-serif" class=""><span style="font-size: 15px;" class="">“</span><span style="font-size: 11pt;" class="">You don’t care much about the scientific validity of a protocol, nor its reliability, as long as it presents your stoves in a positive light."</span></font></i></span></div></div></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Ron</div><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jan 26, 2018, at 3:56 PM, Xavier Brandao <<a href="mailto:xav.brandao@gmail.com" class="">xav.brandao@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class="Section1" style="page: Section1; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Ron,<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Remarkable how you always deliberately ignore the many questions I am asking you. As well as the answers I’m giving you. I already told you my opinion on all these matters.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">But you pretend not to have read, only to ask again later on.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Fine, I can repeat 1000 times if needed.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">«All the protocols mentioned below already do boil water. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Unbelievable. They don’t boil water, they heat water. This is what I told you already the 02/09/2017:<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class="">« </i><i class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">The water is not boiled, since it has been proved it was rendering the test results false. The water is the medium used to measure heat transferred to the pot.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">It is not about performing a cooking task (boiling water), falsely considered universal, and comparing (or being in fact unable to compare) how stoves fare doing that task. It is about understanding the power delivered by the stove.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Please read the February paper from Lombardi and al. which explains well how different the protocols are.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">It also tells why the HTP and WHT are vastly superior to the WBT.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">The CSI is even better, because of the added element of contextuality. »<o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">And Crispin replied to you on that as well, possibly several times.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« What many protocols that you laud don’t do is make any attempt to even measure char produced. It is ludicrous to tell a stove producer who is marketing a char-making stove (which happens also to be cleaner and more efficient even ignoring char - with high Tier rating in all categories) that you’re sorry - but the approved stove protocol for that country says you must ignore all char when you calculate a Tier. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">The CSI actually measures the remaining fuel. Here is what the protocol says:<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">« The energy consumption rating, whether expressed in M] or in an equivalent mass of raw fuel, is based on the need to draw new raw fuel for the replication of the standard task from the available resource, when possible reusing leftover fuel from a previous replication. It is expressed as the number of MegaJoules theoretically available from the fuel consumed, as received (AR). This approach is taken to avoid using a mass of fuel consumed as a metric. Each time a test is repeated, usable fuel leftover from a previous test will be included, if the stove can burn it. If not, 'fuel consumed’ will be the net energy equivalent all new raw fuel entering the stove per burn cycle. »<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">« Emissions of pollutants are reported from ignition of the fire until the completion of the task including any following burnout phase if that is the local practice.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">If the local practice is to leave the fuel remaining in the fire after cooking to burn out (often applied to tasks such as drying fuel for the next day or drying clothes), all resulting emissions ofthat phase are included in the total emissions. This is the case even if no cooking is done at the very beginning or at the very end because those emissions may create exposure for the family. The Technical Test burn cycle will include this because it is tuned for cultural relevance. »<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Now, if this is not enough, there are other ways to calculate and display the benefits of charcoal leftover by a charcoal-making stove. Show how the beneficiaries can get income from the charcoal saved. Anything but an incorrect efficiency or fuel saving number. Crispin gave you a method. It is not difficult, and there are ways to valorize the charcoal saved, and use it as a sales point to get funding or to get clients.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">« </span></i><b class=""><i class="">[RWL4 Remember the Tier approach was unanimously (I think) recommended at the Lima meeting. » </i></b><i class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Which also recommended the WBT, and was ages ago.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Funny how you always go as far back as the Lima « consensus » from 2011.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">That’s what I told you in my email of the 15/12/2017:<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class="">« Ron, I hope, I really hope you are not talking about the Lima consensus, and the signing of the IWA, because I was at the latter, and we all agree it was forced-fed to us.<o:p class=""></o:p></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class="">We were pressed during the whole workshop to adopt a text, even imperfect, so we could correct it later on. We were pressed to sign, because it was said it was be the only way forward. »</i><i class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Crispin just replied to you:<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class=""><span lang="EN-US" class="">“People sometimes hold their nose and abstain from voting. Sometimes they vote yes to end the pain of participation. Sometimes they vote yes because the package is tolerable or misunderstood. Sometimes things are put in over the objections of 90% of the experts. Surely you are aware of that.”</span></i><i class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">A lot of things have happened since 2011.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« What do you (or anyone) find fault with about Tiers? »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Me, nothing. I told you already about one year ago, the 16/02/2017:<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class="">« No. It is practical to have tiers, a bit like energy ratings for refrigerators or light bulbs.<br class="">I am opposed to that if it is scientifically invalid, like it seems to be. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« But very helpful to achieving better stoves - I think the answer is a clear yes. And your answer to this question is what? »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">See above.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« I think the evidence is strong that Tiers are helpful. Kirk Harris says they are. This is a very complicated topic and we need a shorthand. »</i></b><i class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Where is the evidence showing the Tiers are helpful?<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Again, I prefer to repeat in case you fail to understand, I have no opinion on Tiers.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span class="apple-tab-span"><b class=""><i class="">« </i></b></span><b class=""><i class="">You are not giving any rationale for dropping them - but it seems clear you are opposed to them. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Nope, I’m not giving any. I think Crispin is, but I’m not.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">I am not opposed to Tiers, I am not for it either. I am opposed to the WBT.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« The vast majority of the experts working in WG2 of the ISO285 process are telling us that it is reliable. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Where are the proofs it is reliable? Where is the scientific demonstration? Where are the peer reviewed articles?<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« I hope this comes up for serious discussion at ETHOS and someone can report back on the discussion (and any “vote” if there is one). »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">I hope too. I hope it is held and reported transparently, that people speak freely their mind. I hope it is recorded.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« I am claiming here that you have enrolled a very small subset of test experts. I am predicting an overwhelming favorable discussion - and that GACC should heed that discussion. »</i></b><i class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">There’s no harm in claiming. Let’s see what subset you are able to come up with. Don’t forget to write down the names.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Test experts are good, but I’d rather enroll stove practitioners and manufacturers, the ones who have been selling stoves outside of the U.S.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">So, I ask you one more time to find me the same number of people who are willing to risk their academic credibility by saying that the WBT is reliable and that it should be used.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">What may give you the impression that there are a vast majority of WBT supporters, is that the past WBT promoters do not want to admit they were wrong all this time. There is a vast embarrassed silence you might interpret as support for the WBT. But no one will ever bet a penny on the WBT. It’s not worth a rat’s ass.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« I would urge that GACC make no moves of any kind until they and we can see what WG2 has come up with - and the objections that remain. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">I like the expression « I urge to make no move ».<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Sure, let’s advocate for red tape and status quo. Immobilism. Anything but critical thinking. Remember that we launched the initiative addressed to the GACC one year ago. We have been told to wait. The GACC sure did deliver on waiting.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">The water of the well is toxic, it has been proven by studies, and you are asking us to keep drinking it while the Supreme Court is (maybe) resolving the environmental issue.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« I have put a fair amount of time into this - and willingly admit I have no idea “what the problem is about”. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Then I cannot help you.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><i class="">« <b class="">Time is wasting - and we don’t have time »</b></i><i class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Such wise words. See, we really agree on something here Ron, for once.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Wait, wait … Weren’t you asking just above to wait for the WG2 outputs?<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span class="apple-tab-span"><i class="">« </i></span><b class=""><i class="">[RWL13: And you also said you have not been involved in the (I think) successful WG2 effort. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Nope, I haven’t had the privilege.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« But it makes zero sense to stop when you are almost done (on the key - WG2 - portion) »</i></b><i class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">I never said anything about stopping the TC 285 work. It can go on for 90 more years, if this is what some people want. I do not expect anything from the TC 285, I want us to act and take decisions on testing protocols now.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">« I repeat, your group, from my knowledge (mostly at ETHOS meetings and stove camps, but also as the first coordinator of this list), is in a small minority. »</span></i></b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><br class="">Then maybe you should go out of Oregon once in a while.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span class="apple-tab-span"><i class="">« </i></span><b class=""><i class="">[RWL15: For one - me. I see no-one promoting char-making stoves on your list. »</i></b><i class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></i></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Go ahead and ask the signees if they have anything against any technology.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span class="apple-tab-span"><i class="">« </i></span><b class=""><i class="">[RWL16: Sure, but you are calling to restart a 5 year process. We don’t have time for such non-sense. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><i class="">« That is already embedded in what you are calling to start over. »<o:p class=""></o:p></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">You have beaten your own olympic record in intellectual dishonesty. Congratulations, because it was not an easy task.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Since January 2017, I told exactly that Ron, many times, and you know it very well:<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 36pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: -18pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Symbol; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><span class="">·<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';" class=""> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">We have to stop using the WBT – NOW<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 36pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: -18pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Symbol; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><span class="">·<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';" class=""> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">We have to use the long-time existing, immediately available, easy to use alternative protocols – NOW<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 36pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: -18pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Symbol; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><span class="">·<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';" class=""> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">If someone thinks the WBT is reliable and should be used, he/she should speak and present arguments – NOW<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 36pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: -18pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Symbol; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><span class="">·<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';" class=""> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">If someone thinks transitioning to alternative protocols is difficult, he/should should say so, and why - NOW<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 36pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: -18pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Symbol; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><span class="">·<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';" class=""> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span></span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">If someone thinks other alternative protocols should be developed, he/she should say so, and why, and we should start working on it - NOW<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Clear?<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Ron, I understood very well what you have been saying so far. You don’t care much about the scientific validity of a protocol, nor its reliability, as long as it presents your stoves in a positive light.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Then I have great news from you, you probably heard about my new protocol, the Dice Roll Test (DRT). You can get your stoves on Tiers as well. You should really try it. Good news, it is simple to use, and it is available to you right now.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">I also have another one which involves throwing darts. You’ll love it. You’ll get high rankings for your stoves, guaranteed.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Best,<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Xavier<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div></div><div id="DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class=""><table style="border-top-width: 1px; border-top-style: solid; border-top-color: rgb(211, 212, 222);" class=""><tbody class=""><tr class=""><td style="width: 55px; padding-top: 18px;" class=""><a href="https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient" target="_blank" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><img src="https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif" alt="" width="46" height="29" style="width: 46px; height: 29px;" class=""></a></td><td style="width: 470px; padding-top: 17px; color: rgb(65, 66, 78); font-size: 13px; font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; line-height: 18px;" class="">Garanti sans virus.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient" target="_blank" style="color: rgb(68, 83, 234); text-decoration: underline;" class="">www.avast.com</a></td></tr></tbody></table></div></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></body></html>