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<p class="MsoNormal">Ryan and all,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks for the reply.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I have learned that the word “significant” is a relative term. [[[ some of my relatives are not significant.
<span style="font-family:"Segoe UI Emoji",sans-serif">😊</span> ]]]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Seriously, significance is relative. And we need to know numbers and interpret them correctly.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Theoretical question: In my RoCC kilns that have a partial cover/hood that brings most of the emissions to chimneys, there is more time that the emissions are “contained” and also that they are forced together or “concentrated”. I SUSPECT
that the hood/ chimneys should result in more combustion of any combustible (including methane). And if the problem continues, then there are options for taller chimneys or cleaning of combustion in the chimneys.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">When my RoCC kiln gets into use in northern California, I hope it can be tested by you when travel becomes “normal” again.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Paul<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Doc / Dr TLUD / Paul S. Anderson, PhD --- Website: <a href="http://www.drtlud.com/">
<span style="color:#0563C1">www.drtlud.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Email: <a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu"><span style="color:#0563C1">psanders@ilstu.edu</span></a> Skype: paultlud<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Phone: Office: 309-452-7072 Mobile & WhatsApp: 309-531-4434<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Exec. Dir. of Juntos Energy Solutions NFP Go to: <a href="http://www.juntosnfp.org/">
<span style="color:#0563C1">www.JuntosNFP.org</span></a> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Inventor of RoCC kilns and author of Biochar white paper : See
<a href="http://www.woodgas.energy/resources"><span style="color:#0563C1">www.woodgas.energy/resources</span></a>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Author of “<i>A Capitalist Carol</i>” (free digital copies at
<a href="http://www.capitalism21.org/"><span style="color:#0563C1">www.capitalism21.org</span></a>)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> with pages 88 – 94 about solving the world crisis for clean cookstoves.
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Ryan Thompson <ryan@mtnaireng.com> <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 14, 2021 12:38 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Anderson, Paul <psanders@ilstu.edu><br>
<b>Cc:</b> MacCarty, Nordica <Nordica.MacCarty@oregonstate.edu>; Dean Still <deankstill@gmail.com>; Sam Bentson - Apro <sbentson@aprovecho.org>; Dave Lello <pelletsig@gmail.com>; Christian Rakos - Germany - Pellets <rakos@propellets.at>; Discussion of biomass
cooking stoves <stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org>; main@Biochar.groups.io<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Methane emissions from flame cap kilns FW: ARC E-Newsletter 1/13/21: Inventor's Pride - Watch Out!<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#EB0000">[This message came from an external source. If suspicious, report to
<a href="mailto:abuse@ilstu.edu">abuse@ilstu.edu</a>] <o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#38761D">Hi Paul,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#38761D">I do not contribute to the ARC newsletter, but see my answers to your questions below.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#38761D">Thanks,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#38761D">Ryan</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Thu, Jan 14, 2021 at 7:47 AM Anderson, Paul <<a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu" target="_blank">psanders@ilstu.edu</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Dean and Sam and Nordica (leaders at Aprovecho) and all (especially Ryan Thompson and Christian Rakos),<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Your newsletter is appreciated, and the message this time needs to be taken to heart by all of us (see below). Inventions need to be tested and claims should not be based on the
absence of evidence.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">One point that comes to mind is the comment that there is methane coming off of the fires of flame-cap charcoal makers (open top cavity kilns) such as the Oregon kilns and Kon-Tiki.
This also could apply to my covered top cavity kilns.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">I know that char makers are not the focus of Aprovecho. My question is whether or not Aprovecho has tested for methane or could test for methane. And if Ryan or Christian do
testing for methane.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#38761D">I can test for methane. I have a methane sensor in my emissions equipment.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">And then the questions become: What results are known?
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#38761D">I have seen one publication that reports methane emission factors for kon tiki kilns (Cornelissen 2016). I have only done a few emission measurements since I added the methane sensor, but I measured a burn pile
and methane emissions were significant. I am looking forward to doing more measurements and sharing more quantitative results with you. In general, from my measurements, I would say that if a burn has significant emissions of other incomplete combustion products
such as CO and visible smoke, then methane emissions are probably significant too.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Where and how can methane emissions from flame cap kilns (open or covered tops) be conducted?
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#38761D">I offer emission testing services for all types of kilns. The equipment is portable so the measurements can be done anywhere:</span>
<a href="http://www.mtnaireng.com/Emissions-Equipment/">http://www.mtnaireng.com/Emissions-Equipment/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> Is this an important topic?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#38761D">yes </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">There is a corollary to the Aprovecho statement in the newsletter: Issues such as methane emissions that are NOT tested should not be readily embraced as if the doubts are actually
true or worthy of embracing. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Looking forward to the discussion.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Paul<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Doc / Dr TLUD / Paul S. Anderson, PhD --- Website:
<a href="http://www.drtlud.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#0563C1">www.drtlud.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> Email:
<a href="mailto:psanders@ilstu.edu" target="_blank"><span style="color:#0563C1">psanders@ilstu.edu</span></a> Skype: paultlud<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> Phone: Office: 309-452-7072 Mobile & WhatsApp: 309-531-4434<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Exec. Dir. of Juntos Energy Solutions NFP Go to:
<a href="http://www.juntosnfp.org/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#0563C1">www.JuntosNFP.org</span></a>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Inventor of RoCC kilns and author of Biochar white paper : See
<a href="http://www.woodgas.energy/resources" target="_blank"><span style="color:#0563C1">www.woodgas.energy/resources</span></a>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Author of “<i>A Capitalist Carol</i>” (free digital copies at
<a href="http://www.capitalism21.org/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#0563C1">www.capitalism21.org</span></a>)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> with pages 88 – 94 about solving the world crisis for clean cookstoves.
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b>From:</b> Aprovecho Research Center <<a href="mailto:info@aprovecho.org" target="_blank">info@aprovecho.org</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, January 13, 2021 7:31 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Aprovecho Research Center eNewsletter <<a href="mailto:enewsletter@aprovecho.org" target="_blank">enewsletter@aprovecho.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> ARC E-Newsletter 1/13/21: Inventor's Pride - Watch Out!<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white;background-attachment:scroll;background-position-x:0%;background-position-y:0%">
<b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#EB0000">[This message came from an external source. If suspicious, report to
<a href="mailto:abuse@ilstu.edu" target="_blank">abuse@ilstu.edu</a>] </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><a href="http://www.aprovecho.org/" target="_blank"><span style="border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100%" id="m_-5547649814356045952m_8048386440231402351m_3731762957974903878gmail-m_-4191939245568879470Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:image001.jpg@01D6EA7A.9FE80120" alt="Image removed by sender. E-news from Aprovecho Research Center"></span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<h1 style="margin-bottom:11.25pt"><span style="font-size:21.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#213B19">Inventor's Pride: Watch Out!</span><o:p></o:p></h1>
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<span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="m_-5547649814356045952m_8048386440231402351m_3731762957974903878gmail-m_-4191939245568879470Picture_x0020_2" src="cid:image002.jpg@01D6EA7A.9FE80120" alt="Image removed by sender."></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p align="center" style="text-align:center;line-height:16.5pt"><i><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Almost perfect!</span></i><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="line-height:16.5pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Having unbiased villagers or Dr. Jim Jetter test Aprovecho’s Lorena stove might have helped to reduce our embarrassment when again and again the open fire
was proven to be much more fuel efficient! Inventor’s pride is a well-known human frailty. Creating a truth-telling team including all the folks concerned with a stove project helps to address the inventor who is doing what feels natural and right, but can
be misguided. It happens at ARC frequently!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="line-height:16.5pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">The ARC team has found that an engineer/researcher may know more about the thermodynamics of a stove, but the expertise of cooks, manufacturers, distributors,
retailers, and funders in the stove project need to be included in the decision making process from start to maturity. Test, test, test!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="line-height:16.5pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">As Dr. Kirk Smith said, “You get what you inspect, not what you expect”.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="line-height:16.5pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Our advice is to test everything frequently from all angles and try to respond to problems without inventor’s pride. It’s not easy! Cognitive dissonance
messes up judgement all the time. It’s easy to think, “I am intelligent, and make good decisions.” Admitting a mistake can threaten that image of self. It can be really hard to hear someone say, “Man, that Lorena stove is terrible! How could you have been
so dumb?” </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="line-height:16.5pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Use criticisms as a tool to improve your product. Take time to assess and define the problems. Consult with your team about how to make improvements, and
then move forward towards a more successful outcome.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="line-height:16.5pt"><i><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Find resources, publications and information about our work at
<a href="http://www.aprovecho.org" target="_blank">aprovecho.org</a>.</span></i><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#505050">Find archived newsletters online at
<a href="http://aprovecho.org/newsletters/" target="_blank">aprovecho.org/newsletters</a><br>
© 2020 Aprovecho Research Center/Advanced Studies in Appropriate Technology<br>
76132 Blue Mountain School Road, PO Box 1175, Cottage Grove, Oregon, 97424 - USA<br>
(541) 767-0287 • <a href="http://www.aprovecho.org" target="_blank">www.aprovecho.org</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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Please consider making a donation to Aprovecho Research Center if you have enjoyed this content:
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