[Gasification] Biochar et al.

David Murphy djfmurphy at dodo.com.au
Mon Dec 9 20:51:52 CST 2013


Anand, thanks for your comments.      I answer 
them in the text below.

On 10/12/2013 12:13 PM, Anand Karve wrote:
> Dear David,
> rock dust is certainly a good additive to soil, 
> but the ordinary soil in our fields is itself 
> derived from the rocks underneath the soil layer 
> and therefore soil contains more or less the 
> same minerals that the rock contains. 
> ***Anand**that's not quite correct and to 
> explain what I mean would require quite a deal 
> of space.   Soil is one commiodity about which 
> it is impossible to make blanket statements.* 
> Secondly, you have quoted that according to John 
> D. Hamaker the microbes produced  enzymes which 
> dissolved the minerals in the rock dust. *That's 
> not correct either.  I didn't credit  JDH with 
> that statement, it is a biological fac**t**.*    
> That is true in the case of a few 
> minerals which  are in the form of calcium 
> salts.   But water is a universal solvent 
> and all minerals are soluble in water to a small 
> extent. *Anand, any mineral is soluble in water 
> provided it is in a water soluble form.****In 
> basalt - or any rock form - it is not water 
> soluble and you rely entirely on enzymes. * They 
> are taken up by the microbes directly, because 
> the microbes absorb them through their entire 
> cell surface, which is a more efficient manner 
> of absorption than the plants,which absorb 
> minerals only through their root hairs. *I'd 
> like to read more of this - can you give me a 
> credible reference please ? *   The soil 
> solution represents a saturated solution of the 
> minerals.    Therefore, any mineral molecule 
> that is removed from the solution by either 
> plants or microbes, gets replaced immediately 
> from the pool of undissolved minerals in the 
> soil. This property is called dynamic 
> equilibrium.    A 1 meter thick layer of soil 
> has enough minerals to allow you to conduct 
> agriculture for about 25000 years. *Not in 
> Australia and many other countries !****"Soils 
> ain't soils !".     Australia, for example, 
> missed the last Ice Age and a 1 metre thick 
> slice of our soil won't keep your belly full for 
> more than a couple of birthdays.    Australian 
> soils are deficient in most minerals and were 
> almost entirely leached of P. Australian topsoil 
> averages around 12mm thick.  For this reason our 
> agricultural productivity leapt ahead once we 
> accessed the P in guano from Christmas Island 
> and then from Nauru.    Then we set up 
> superphosphate manufacturing and the rest in 
> history.    Australia is not unique.****But some 
> areas here are quite mineral rich and you can 
> add rock dust as heavy and as aften as you like 
> and get no result, because it doesn't need 
> minerals.    But most other areas do need it and 
> you differentiate through soil analysis.* 
> *Bu**t, all our soil and soils of the world 
> desperately need more Organic Matter.* *Our 
> national average is under 1%, where 5% is a 
> desired minimum.
> *
*    For general interest**have a look at 
http://rfcarchives.org.au/Next/CaringForTrees/Remineralisation3-94.htm 
      Got to go !  DJM.
*
> Yours A.D.Karve
> On Sun, Dec 8, 2013 at 9:45 AM, David Murphy 
> <djfmurphy at dodo.com.au 
> <mailto:djfmurphy at dodo.com.au>> wrote:
>
>     Joe, you might find it of interest to look
>     up John D. Hamaker on the net.  He was an
>     American Mechanical Engineer who turned his
>     mind (and subsequently devoted his life) to
>     improving soil by the addition of rock dust.
>     He saw global warming as a precursor to the
>     next ice age. He saw an ice age as essential
>     refurbishment of the earth's resources.    
>     His argument has a lot of good solid logioc
>     to it and it's worth adding to your store of
>     knowledge on the general topic.     If he's
>     proven right, then we're in a lot of trouble
>     !    If you want to study it further I have
>     a DVD I made from a tape he produced I could
>     let you have.
>
>     Rock dust is a storehouse of minerals, all
>     of which are essential to growth.    First
>     to plants and then to the animals which eat
>     them - including us humans.   Rock dust is
>     insoluble to water but not to enzymes which
>     are produced by soil benevolent bacteria -
>     bacteria which are present in soil with good
>     OM and in compost.     Many readers of this
>     string will be aware of it's benefits when
>     used as fertiliser.
>
>     Seeking to remedy climate change purported
>     to be caused by anthropomorphic global
>     warming is an extraordinarily complex
>     question.   And seeking to make a
>     contribution by sequestering carbon as
>     charcoal is in itself another complex range
>     of issues.     The charcoal must be first
>     ligneos carbon - wood - and it is probably
>     almost as good to lock up some of that
>     carbon in timber for building houses or
>     making furniture.
>
>     I'd promote the first step by making the
>     sequestration of the carbon as part of a
>     broader program of building building soil
>     organic matter OM.   This includes animate
>     carbon as well as vegetative.     At least
>     get it up to 5% to plough depth, say 10
>     inches (250mm) as a minimum, aiming at
>     20%.   That in itself locks away a lot of
>     carbon, but of a different nature, in that
>     it's available to contribute to plant
>     growth, growth without the need for chemical
>     or artificial fertilisers.
>
>     Every 1% increase in soil OM (world wide)
>     would be a lockup of around 30 billion
>     tonnes of carbon in  a world which generates
>     now (probably) 20 million tonnes
>     annually.    Just for the record, the
>     biggest emitter of CO2, bigger than every
>     other agency combined - every factory,
>     airplane, car truck tractor etc and so on -
>     is the soil of the earth as it respires.   
>     So, the more land we put down under crop to
>     feed the increasing billions, the more CO2
>     we produce and put into the atmosphere.
>
>     So, it's a race against a proven runner - so
>     called mother Nature - and she's a proven
>     stayer.
>
>     On the other hand, some of the wise owls are
>     now saying it's not CO2 at all, but PCB's
>     causing the damage.   Maybe they're right -
>     who knows _for sure ?_    Nobody I'm aware
>     of despite what they say.    It's all
>     conjecture, some of it soundly based, but
>     still conjecture relying on historical info
>     compiled over a geological blink.
>
>     Using charcoal and zeolite together is a bit
>     like wearing belt & braces with
>     self-supporting trousers.     It certainly
>     works !
>
>     The easy and less costly way is to just get
>     the OM into the soil and plant stuff to grow
>     and suck up all the CO2 and N.
>
>     But whatever you do, don't stop the good work.
>
>     David Murphy.
>
>
>     On 08/12/2013 12:33 PM, Joe Barnas wrote:
>>     DAVID,
>>
>>     Thankyou for the insightful overview of
>>     biochar and comparative functionality of
>>     Zeolite, of which I was not familiar.
>>
>>     However one thing I am focused on is how to
>>     address catastrophic global climate change
>>     and for that having billions of gardeners
>>     sequestering carbon, while building healthy
>>     soil and hence healthy food is not
>>     something that Zeolite can provide.  It is
>>     another tool in growing food, yes, but
>>     let's not lose sight of the long term
>>     benefit of promoting biochar.  I might even
>>     try mixing some with biochar just to gain
>>     the N adsorption benefits.
>>
>>
>>     On Fri, Dec 6, 2013 at 2:00 PM, David
>>     Murphy <djfmurphy at dodo.com.au
>>     <mailto:djfmurphy at dodo.com.au>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>         Greetings Biochar/Gasifier people !
>>
>>         Everybody & his dog seems to have
>>         something to say about
>>         charcoal/biochar/biochar-compost mix
>>         and so on.    Well, here's another dog
>>         to bark his piece !
>>
>>         Biochar is often seen as the great
>>         agricultural panacea, but _it is
>>         not_.Biochar is a name given to plain
>>         ordinary charcoal to indicate that it
>>         is destined for use in soil
>>         improvement, but basically it is still
>>         plain ordinary charcoal, just crushed
>>         into smaller particles. In some
>>         circumstances it is a very beneficial
>>         tool but it is not magical as some
>>         proponents seem to think.   Just
>>         remember, all charcoal has a bio-origin
>>         - wood.
>>
>>         In some Ag. trials in Australiait
>>         significantly improved crop volume
>>         (treble in one case) but in other
>>         instances, nothing worth writing home
>>         about.It depends on what the soil is
>>         like to start with.
>>
>>         Charcoal is stable.That means it does
>>         not take part in any composting system
>>         (which is one primarily of bacterial
>>         digestion) and it is indigestible so
>>         that when offered as a dietary
>>         supplement (in poultry food for
>>         example) it passes through the
>>         digestive system physically unchanged
>>         but will adsorb a high proportion of
>>         the gases and some toxins produced in
>>         the process of digestion, because that
>>         is what charcoal does.    For this
>>         reason, it's adsorption capability,
>>         poultry will generally do better on a
>>         little charcoal.
>>
>>         Quite a few pages could be filled on
>>         the beneficial services provided by
>>         charcoal as it travels through the
>>         digestive system, but it does it as
>>         charcoal only and as nothing else.   By
>>         all means use a little in the feed, you
>>         can only benefit.
>>
>>         The only physical way to change the
>>         nature of charcoal is to burn it.   
>>         That is why it lasts in soil (or
>>         wherever it is) for thousands of years.
>>
>>         It has an incredibly high surface area
>>         of 360 m^2 (varies) and is a mass of
>>         minute tunnels which in turn means a
>>         very high volume and gases become
>>         trapped in these tunnels.It does not
>>         _ab_sorb, it _ad_sorbs and traps
>>         only.The difference between absorb and
>>         adsorb is the same as the difference in
>>         liquids of suspension and solution.Clay
>>         particles will be in suspension, sugar
>>         and salt go into solution.
>>
>>         Charcoal is useful in an aerobic
>>         composting system because again of the
>>         entrapment of air in the tunnels.A
>>         composting system goes well if there is
>>         enough oxygen bearing air available to
>>         the bacteria which are a significant
>>         part of the system.The more air, the
>>         higher the population of bacteria
>>         (other factors being OK). The charcoal
>>         itself is inoperative, and doesn't
>>         change, nor is it a catalyst, it simply
>>         provides a service.   It will only
>>         provide a haven for soil benevolent
>>         bacteria if there is something trapped
>>         in the tunnels which the bacteria can eat.
>>
>>         Charcoal is a good adsorber of gas and
>>         liquid simply because that is what it
>>         does.Zeolite on the other hand, can
>>         have an even higher surface are per
>>         gram and has a propensity to entrap
>>         gases, most particularly nitrogen in
>>         it's various forms -- as gas --
>>         ammonium for example -- and in liquids
>>         as a salt of NO_3 .It actually draws
>>         them in (like a magnet attracts ferric
>>         objects) where charcoal just takes it
>>         as it comes.    It is easy to see also
>>         why charcoal is so effective as a
>>         filter, but if you have a solution rich
>>         in nitrogen, run it through Zeolite and
>>         the N will be removed. Add some to the
>>         litter in poultry grower sheds, there
>>         will be fewer mortalities because the
>>         ammonia which sometimes will asphixiate
>>         small birds will be absorbed.   
>>         Zeolite will take N out of solution,
>>         charcoal will not.    There's 40
>>         natural forms of Zeolite and more than
>>         another 150 can be synthesised, so
>>         choose carefully for the one most
>>         appropriate to your problem. Zeolite
>>         can perform an amazing range of
>>         actions.    Once used and applied as
>>         fertiliser, Zeolite subsequently will
>>         release the N slowly and remain in the
>>         soil as a balancer of N.  Too much, it
>>         will take it in (so that the soil pH is
>>         not lowered) and release it as required.
>>
>>         Charcoal's great stuff though, it's
>>         easy to make and holds answers to a lot
>>         of problems - but not all !
>>
>>         David Murphy.
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>     -- 
>>     Joe Barnas
>>     Portland, OR
>>     541-525-1665
>>
>>
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>
>
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>
>
> -- 
> ***
> Dr. A.D. Karve
> Trustee & Founder President, Appropriate Rural 
> Technology Institute (ARTI)
>
>
>
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