[Greenbuilding] Redoing all floors
Anncha
anncha1 at aol.com
Thu Jul 28 09:25:44 CDT 2011
All the jobs I have been involved in we have only used a sealer once,
and it was in a commercial setting. Too shiny, for my personal taste.
With wax, the floors are matte more looking and grow more beautiful
by the year and take on their own patina. One caveat, the first two
weeks, the floors are a little slippery, but after that, no worries.
Anncha
Anncha Briggs, ASID/ASRID
AR State Registered Interior Designer #2001
NCIDQ Certificate #015650
design and art consultation
T 501 663 1016
E anncha1 at aol.com
Please consider the environment before printing this email.
On Jul 28, 2011, at 8:59 AM, Ktot (g) wrote:
> I have been told by numerous concrete contractors that after the
> stain, a sealer is always applied--one of several possible types.
> Then a layer of wax may be applied, as that provides a scuff or
> scratch layer. But without exception, everyone told me after
> staining, they apply a sealer before any possible wax.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Anncha
> To: Green Building
> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2011 10:38 PM
> Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] Redoing all floors
>
> I don't understand why anyone would seal the stained floors. Waxing
> is so much nicer, it gives a beautiful warm glow. I did my floors
> ten years ago, waxed them
> and was told to wax them every year, did that once but have never
> bothered again. I am so happy with them and get compliments all the
> time.
>
> Anncha
>
> Anncha Briggs, ASID/ASRID
> AR State Registered Interior Designer #2001
> NCIDQ Certificate #015650
> design and art consultation
> T 501 663 1016
>
> E anncha1 at aol.com
>
> Please consider the environment before printing this email.
>
> On Jul 27, 2011, at 5:34 PM, Ktot (g) wrote:
>
>> I can't imagine the dark stains that are peeling up are white
>> based, but I'm no stain expert and (another problem) the contractor
>> refuses to tell me the brand/name of stain used (other than it's
>> water-based).
>>
>> What do you mean "the concrete was never acid etched before using
>> the sealer"? I don't believe anything was done after staining
>> before sealing other than waiting a few days. What is the etching
>> that should have been done--how is it done, etc.? This could be
>> useful in further documenting the problems (since ultimately the
>> contractor IS going to be paying for my new floor, though probably
>> not by their choice).
>>
>> Also can you explain more about shot blasting? You say it's more
>> cost-effective, but how does it compare to grinding as far as time
>> involved, how much it's going to totally mess up my house, etc.? No
>> one's mentioned this yet but it sounds like something I should look
>> into, especially since sealer removal will be required whether I go
>> with more concrete staining or with tile (or something else I
>> haven't yet considered). We're talking about 1500 sq. ft. in
>> multiple rooms and hallways.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Andrew Pace
>> To: Green Building
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2011 5:23 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] Redoing all floors
>>
>> Non-acid stains like soy stains or polymer stains only sit on the
>> surface and in some of the macro-pores of the concrete. Acid stain
>> works by chemically reacting with the free lime in the concrete and
>> the salts in the stain, to physically alter the chemistry of the
>> concrete, thus changing the color. The white you see could be a
>> white base stain, or, it could be that the concrete was never acid
>> etched before using the sealer. Acid etching removes the “cream”
>> off the surface of the concrete. This is the fine white or grey
>> powder that will eventually dust off the surface. Without removing
>> the cream, any coating or topical stain will eventually peel off
>> the surface, since its only sticking to dust.
>>
>> Grinding and shot blasting are two different ways to achieve the
>> same end result. It its a large area, shot blasting will be more
>> cost effective and will require less prep before the next coating
>> is applied.
>>
>>
>> Andrew Pace
>> Green Design Center®
>> Waukesha, WI
>>
>>
>>
>> On 7/27/11 5:05 PM, "Ktot (g)" <ktottotc at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I have been told water-based stain--which was used to get the
>> mottled creative pattern that was intended (without white blooms)--
>> does not sink into the concrete like acid-stain does. Either way,
>> where the stain and sealer have pulled up, there's plain white.
>> It's chalky. Numerous concrete contractors had no idea what that
>> was, telling me my contractor must have done a white layer of stain
>> first, which I knew was not the case. One finally pointed out it's
>> calcium carbonate that chemically reacted to something (the diesel/
>> propane fuel? the exterior stain that was used indoors [as I later
>> found out]?) That makes sense to me as one gets white on the finger
>> when rubbing those areas. The white areas are all white--the stain
>> has completely lifted up. So it does not seem to have gone down
>> into the concrete--unless there is more under the calcium carbonate.
>>
>> Also I should have mentioned earlier much of the sealer seems to
>> have disappeared. When put down it was very shiny (as it was
>> supposed to remain) but now in many areas there appears to be
>> little or no sealer (this is from work done two months ago), and
>> one contractor commented the sealer is soft (vs. it supposedly the
>> hardest, most durable there is per my contractor who clearly misled
>> me in numerous ways).
>>
>> Per the sealer tech rep, the sealer does need to be removed whether
>> I go with concrete again or with tile. He seems to lean towards
>> grinding to remove it. Is that the same as the shot blast you
>> mention?
>>
>>
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